CPU Clock Multiplier

Rockser, Mattman

I just inspected my MB very closely and I can not find anything wrong with it. All the capacitors are round without bulges and discoloration and none are leaking.

The heat sink over the Northbridge chip is golden, so it is copper; the silver heat sink is on my Video card.

I will try and find some Arctic silver over the weekend and replace it.

A while back I installed the Case fan myself and I am not sure if I did it correctly.
Does it need blow into the case or does it need to blow the air out of the case?
I don’t have any instruction on that any more.
Thanks
Sven

 

Sven:

Quick rule of thumb is front fans are intakes, back fans exhaust. Now one can get into all kinds of permutations but a basic setup will have an intake in the bottom front that ***** (sounds like stucks) cool air into the case and another chasis fan mounted on the back which pulls warm air out of the case.

 

At the moment I am trying to get my install of Vista working correctly so I have not been able to reread the old thread. Rockster, thanks for clarifying the clocking situation. I will reread the thread if I get bored wrestling with Vista [at the moment I am only just staying in the ring ]

Sven, the air circulation goes from bottom/front of the case to top/back of the case. If the case fan is at the back near the PSU, it should blow out (exhaust). If you look at the sides of the fan, it should have an arrow for the direction of flow.

Matt

 

Rockster, mattman,

It looks like I installed the fan correctly, it is sucking the air out.

Speaking of heat, I looked at my bios setup and found 3 temp readouts. One is for the CPU and reads at startup 28c because it is still cool. The other two show a temp of minus 56 and minus 34. How can that be? I am in LA and it is not that cold.
Has my bios gone bad? Should I re-flash it?
Or worth is my BM going dead?

Well, I am going to get some arctic silver now.

Thanks again
Sven

 

Hi Guys.
I just found something on ubid while looking for Arctic silver.
Would that help diagnose the problem I have?
Would you take a look at this and let me know?
http://www.ubid.com/Diagnostic_POST_Card_ISA_PCI_Motherboard_Test_Debug_Decode/a901486098.html
Thanks
Sven

 

I have been waiting to see if Rockster might have some suggestions. I think a lot of our suggestions and reservations have already been stated.

It might be a matter of heading in one direction or the other, that is, starting from the hardware side and checking/updating through to the OS side or visa versa.

The hardware may be OK, but if a good set of chipset drivers is not installed, the CPU clocking control programs may not be "communicating" correctly with the BIOS and causing, say, the Northbridge chip to be overworked/overheated. Then again, those negative temperatures in the BIOS would concern me. As Rockster mentioned, have you used the correct BIOS update? The motherboard may be an ECS model, but it may be a cut-down model, with minimal features. HP have a similar arrangement using Asus motherboards. If it is a special motherboard for Emachines you may only be able to use Emachine's BIOS upgrades (and they may not supply any).

Bottom line? If your efforts are not successful, consider another motherboard (you may need to get another case to fit it into), but basically, branded computers are not made to be upgradable. Yes, you can add more RAM and install a CPU of the same type a few steps up, but that's about all.

It might be some sort of "exterior" problem that you can fix with, say, replacing the thermal compound. It might be that you just cannot do what you are trying to do.

This is the Emachine upgraders website:
http://www.emachine-upgraders.info/

Matt

 

Matt:

I'm just waiting to see what happens when Sven gets his processor and heatsink squared away with Artic Silver and when we are sure he's got the original chipset drivers installed. If I understand this correctly, this is not a stock emachines machine - Sven has a custom written BIOS. On balence, I think we are pretty much in agreement and it sounds like Sven has a good handle on his immediate course of action.

Removing all of those software overclocking programs, cleaning the registry and then reinstalling only the one or two that he is comfortable with and confident of will be my next advice; however, I'm kind of a methodical slow poke "one step at a time" type guy so I will withold specific guidance until the HSF and chipset issues have been handled.

Sven: I'd prefer you to go slow and take this one step at a time too. As to the diagnostic post card - six of one, half dozen of the other. I rarely use one but some swear by them. One other question - next time you do some intense computing and have a lot of CPU activity for an extended period of time, I'd like you to touch that bare heatsink on your chipset with one finger and then post back as to how hot it "feels ". If it feels too hot to touch, please report it as such. Lets not worry about that BIOS for the time being - absent a bad $2.50 battery, a severe electrical spike, some kind of massive EMF or an EEPROM programmer (you're not supposed to know that one off the top your head), your BIOS should be just as it has been since the day you flashed it.

Regards,

 

Rockster, mattman,

Thanks for your continued help.

You mentioned in your post "absent a $ 2.59 battery" I did go to a local repair shop and the guy replaced a small round battery, and charges $10.00 for it.
If that would mess up the Bios, then we got the problem pegged with the sensors.

I went back this morning and looked at the temp readout in the Bios and found:

At Startup: Temp 1= 88c temp 2= 24c temp 3= -55
After 1 minute 1= 120c temp 2=30c temp 3= -55
After 2 minutes 1= 128 temp 2 32c temp 3= -55

Shortly after that the temp on readout 1 changed to minus 128 and then slowly goes back to minus 46

Strange behavior.

I ordered Arctic Silver and it should be here when I am back from my trip.

BTW, my Bios is from e-support and they say it works with e-machines. Back then I also talked to e-machines and they told me that they will not give out any Bios, because they know that there system runs perfect and don’t need a bios upgrade.
Nice, isn’t it.

I let you know when I have the CPU reinstalled with Arctic Silver.

Thanks
Sven

 

The stepwise approach sounds good to me.

One thing I would suggest Sven, is that when you have the heatsink removed, take out the CPU and check carefully that there are no bent pins.

Matt

 

Hi mattman and Rockster2u

I just replaced the thermal compound with Arctic Silver.
I cleaned of the old stuff of cause. All the pins on the CPU are straight.
I then fired it up but stayed in the bios on the screen that tells me the temperature.
It started out at 27c. After idling for 10 minutes the temp was at 39c. I then proceeded to boot into windows. I again checked the temp with cpu informer and it was 40c.

BTW, I uninstalled RM clock modifier. It was the only one that needed uninstalling. The other 2 (Crystal cpu id and cpu informer) do not need to be installed. You just click on the .EXE file to run it.
As I am writing this, I again checked the temp and it is a 40c.

O.K. , what is next?

Thanks for your help
Sven

 

That's a good question. I'd take a look at running Everest V1.51 or V2.20 and see what it has to say about your current CPU speed when none of your "software clocking" programs are running. Pending what it has to say, then an evaluation can be made as to whether or not a "clocking" program is necessary at all. And, if it is necessary - then which one?

You are going to have to do some experimenting. Personally, I'd go right to the max and see what happens and I don't think I'd be inclined to keep throttling things back and forth. Once I found a nice stable speed that would permit one to run everything without a problem, I'd set it and leave it alone. Obviously this has to accomplished within a tolerable temperature range or the CPU life could be shortened.

Let us know what your thoughts are .... No one has a monopoly on brains.

 

Hi Rockster,

Thanks for sticking with me.

I ran Everest 2.2 and the CPU speed is:
800Mhz ( 6 x 133 ) it also identifies the CPU correctly.

If there is such a thing, I would like to have the clocking software start up
automatically when I boot. The 3 I have will not do that. I have to go in and run it.

The best would be if I can find a Bios that recognizes the chip and that it has Power now capabilities, so it only speeds up when needed.

I guess I could ask badflash.com if they can do it.

Any other ideas?

Thanks
Sven

 

Well, it sure sounds to me like that particular BIOS leaves a lot to be desired. You have what is one of the best, if not the best socket A processor ever made and its paired with a second rate motherboard and/or third rate BIOS. You can try www.badflash.com but you may have more success finding a better BIOS file by trolling a few ECS motherboard forums or some OC forums. Another avenue of pursuit which may bring some relief is a little device called a BIOS Savior. I used to get these from Sweden. The device allows one to piggyback two BIOS chips and select either/or by togggling a switch attached to the device.

Whatever you do, don't get rid of that processor. I'm not trying to rub it in but on a decent motherboard, that puppy will fly. The best boards I have worked with using 462 Athlon mobiles are ABIT NF7S Rev 2 and the DFI LanParty II boards with NVidia chipsets. 2600+ Mobiles will run at 12x200 at default voltages without breaking a sweat and can be pushed further by bumping up the core voltage.

I don't quite understand the infatuation with a variable speed setting as referenced in your power now comment. If one has a machine that runs at 2400MHz (my 12x200 example) and it does that at very low temperatures with stock voltages, why would on ever want to slow it down? We aren't talking about a laptop where power savings might extend battery life - we are talking about a desktop. Personally, I'd prefer to have the horsepower there all the time whether I need it right now or not.

I don't use software clocking programs and can't really advise you further in this regard. If I can't "hard set" the BIOS, its not a keeper. You may want to keep looking for an answer, but I'm afraid that this author doesn't have an answer for that processor on that motherboard coupled with that BIOS. Not being able to hard set the multiplier or the BUS speed is what I would call "unacceptable ". Hopefully, someone else may have some ideas but in my book, that BIOS just doesn't cut it. Having said that, I will do some looking for you to see if I can find a better BIOS, however, this may put us in the "risky" zone.

 

Hi Rockster

Thanks for your help.

I send of an E-Mail to badflash explaining what I have and what I want. I know they will send me a new chip. So if it does not work, I can go back to my old chip. Safer then flashing the Bios and not knowing what you get.

The "Infatuation" as you called it, is only because it runs cooler when not in use and therefore should last longer, right? No other reason.

Let’s see what badflash has to say about this.

I keep you posted.

Thanks again
Sven

 

Sven:

Good move. I can't say enough good about this vendor - they have always been attentive to my needs and have saved my bacon big time on more than one occasion. I think Jack is up in Whiskeyman's neck of the woods.

I'm "hunting" for you right now - haven't been this route for a few years and have already picked up some very good information although its somewaht irrelevent to your immediate needs.

Regards,

 

Rockster,
I found this site. Can you check this and give me some info if this would work?
Thanks

http://www.rom.by/articles/BP/index_english.htm#5

 

Sven:

I just spent 2+ hours looking for a modded BIOS and have come up blank. I did come across a couple of similar site references but this is something I wouldn't attempt myself (well, lets say I wouldn't attempt it without a safety net). Actually, you have nothing to lose provided you cover your backside. The Bios Savior I referenced earlier can be purchased from Eskit Data in Sweden. I believe your actual BIOS chip is a 2 MB variety so shop carefully and reconfirm this. If you get a newly programmed BIOS from Jack, you can use that or your current chip as a failsafe and flash any experimental files or in this case, make the mods on the Eskit Data supplied chip. By my count, that gives you two backup alternatives along with something you can play with.

I like your style ....... good luck.

 

Hi Rockster,
I just got a note from Jack and he tells me that he only puts the bios on a chip, he does not modify it.
That does not work, bacause I don't have one that works propperly.
Would you know anyone who can modify the Bios?

Thanks
Sven

 

Rockster,

If I get 1 of those MBs that you mentioned, I know windows XP will choke when I start it up and I will have to do a repair install to make it work.
Here is the problem:
My version of XP is OEM (wanted to save some money) and if I am not mistaken,
it is "married" to my original MB. Do I have to buy a new copy of XP or will MS let me activate again?
Any experience with this problem?

Thanks
Sven

 

Sven:

First comment ----> I posted yesterday but messed up somehow because it never made it onto the BBS. To recap ......... While I'm aware that Jack doesn't do any BIOS modding, my thinking was/is that he may know where you could get a beta BIOS or a custom BIOS for that particular board. It was a pretty common board but I spent a considerable amount of time looking for an alternative to your current BIOS and came up blank. If I do find something, I'll certainly let you know but my search two days ago was pretty exhaustive so don't hold your breath waiting on me.

The questions I now have focus more on your original problem since you are now running a little cooler. Did you uninstall those soft clocking programs and reinstall only the one or two best and try things that way? I think that was Matt's suggestion and it was a good one. What happens if you set the multiplier and leave it? I'd try that at 14x and I'd also want to see what happens at 16.5x. How does it run? What are the temps? What PSU are you running in there?

As to a different motherboard and repair install - your case probably isn't going to accept a full size ATX board so it becomes more involved. The other thing necessary to achieve something along the lines of a 12x200 (2400MHz actual) with that processor is going to be some high end memory so we are now talking Motherboard, case, power supply and memory - not sure if you want to go that far just because of this processor. One can get a San Diego 4000+ 64 bit processor for about $60 and probably come up with a better build for about the same investment. If you go that route, I'll be glad to buy your 3000+ Mobile.

Personally, my experience has been very good with Microsoft re: doing a repair installation with major hardware changes and using the same OEM XP CD. It will require a phone call to get a new activation code, but again, my experience has been most favorable. Please understand, one does this at their own risk and the "Official Posture" would require purchasing another license; however, I have not encountered any problems in this regard.