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How Fast is Fast Enough

Discussion in 'Windows XP' started by dkline, 2006/10/03.

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  1. 2006/10/05
    charlesvar

    charlesvar Inactive Alumni

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    Its worth a try. And yes, it will erase your settings. But, ZA has a save your settings option, at least it does in the Pro version.
    The auto protect should not be shut down. It scans files that you or the system/app's open and write to on the drive for viruses. If you shut that down, there is no reason to have an AV, that's the heart of an AV's function.

    If you want to shut something off in NAV, then shut LiveUpdate off and check manually. LU was always prone to problems.

    Regards - Charles
     
    charlesvar,
    #21
  2. 2006/10/05
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    Okay, Charles, I found the save settings button in ZA.

    But I've got another question about ZA. In my zones tab in firewall, I seem to have four trusted zones. Yesterday I had three, but disabled my ethernet connection and then re-enabled it while testing bootup times. So maybe a 4th was added when I re-enabled that ethernet connection (to my cable modem). I also have a Dell truemobile wireless router.

    Bottom line, how many trusted networks should I have in ZA and how do I know which ones to remove, if any? I tried removing "new network" and "The internet (2)" but got a message saying I can't remove an active network on both of them. So I have two active networks and two that I could remove if I wish.

    Can you help me figure this out, or is all okay as is?

    Once I get this straightened out, I'll try removing the database files.
     
    dkline,
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  4. 2006/10/05
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    Another couple of questions, Charles (or anyone).

    I looked in the C/Windows/Internet Logs folder and found not just IAMDB.RDB and BACKUP.RDB but about 30 different iterations of each -- as in BACKUP[2][11].RDB, BACKUP[2][12].RDB, IAMDB[2][2].RDB, IAMDB[2][3].RDB, etc. Do I delete them all?

    Also, my tvDebug.log is a text file, 13,292KB in size. I also have a tvDebug.zip file. What do I do with these?

    Also, is there anything I should do in the System Propeties box, such as change my performance settings, virtual memory size (now 3067 MB system managed), whether memory is allocated most for programs or for the system cache, etc?

    And finally, I notice in User Profiles that I have three accounts, not two -- me as administrator (33.2 MB), just plain ol' me (2.39 GB), and one called "Account Unknown" (33.5 MB) that says it was last modified (or, I assume, created) right about the time that the Symantec tech support guy started screwing around with my registry permissions. Should I do anything about this?

    Thanks for any advice you can offer.
     
    Last edited: 2006/10/05
    dkline,
    #23
  5. 2006/10/05
    mattman

    mattman Inactive Alumni

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    NAT is inbuilt in the router. It is a "hardware" firewall, whereas ZA is a software firewall. NATs have better performance than software firewalls.

    "Account Unknown" sounds like it may not be fully recognized by Windows. I would take precautionary steps (backup) before deleting it though.

    Drivers...only a maybe, but you should know where to find them and get familiar with the manufacturer's website. If you were an average "joe" that did not want any more than his/her computer to do what it was supposed to you probably should not bother. If you want to know that it is working...maybe...at around it's optimum, look for driver updates. If you have a branded computer (Dell, HP, Compaq, etc) just look up your model at the manufacturer's support website. If it is a "built" computer, find out the motherboard's make and model number. Use Everest in my signature. If it has separate graphics (not built-in), research first before you go playing around with the graphics drivers, they are quite complex.
    Suggestion...don't use driver updates offered at the Windows Update website. The Windows Updater can select the wrong ones (they may be specialized by the manufacturer).

    BTW, I am still getting a giggle out of the The Theory of Bootability. I have realized for me it needs to include:
    Don't bother turning computer room light on...trip on network cable...kick toe on spare monitor...find smokes have run out...head downstairs to spare pack in car...wake neighbours (4.30am) opening garage door...graze back on half open door...try not to swear at the top of my lungs...:D :D

    Matt
     
    mattman,
    #24
  6. 2006/10/05
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    You mean, create a system restore point?
     
    dkline,
    #25
  7. 2006/10/06
    TonyT

    TonyT SuperGeek Staff

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    re routers: (NAT = Network Address Translation - definition )
    Some routers have built in firewalls, most home routers have minimal firewalls (NAT), not really firewalls per se, but they act as firewalls. What they do is prevent any INBOUND connections unless the request comes from a comp on the lan side. That means that no one can connect to a comp on the lan or no web server or outside users' applications can connect unless it was authorized or originated by the local user. These "firewalls" also do not respond to pings or other protocols used to detect the existance of computers, they hide the lan comps from the rest of the world.

    Some routers have real firewalls using SPI - Stateful Packet Inspection that can be config'd and these firewalls can monitor and control not only INBOUND traffic but OUTBOUND as well. SPI usually is controlled by a set of rules config'd by the user and SPI reads the header info in the packets as they arrive and what it does next is determined by the rules that have been set. SPI can do much more too if other features are available. Software firewalls use a form of SPI, but they also use the computer's resources whereas a router w/ SPI does not depend on the computers' power & resources for anything. Whether or not one needs outbound traffic controls is up to the user & his knowledge-responsibility-control of his systems. I don't need outbound controls thus I don't use a software firewall.

    re booting:
    Often, a large Temp dir can slow down booting, as can the settings in certain applications. Most service type apps that are set to load at boot (antivirus, firewalls, etc) read & write to the user temp dirs:
    c:/windows/temp
    c:/docs & settings/username/local settings/temp
    When these dirs get large, the read-write actions take longer. Deleting the contents of these dirs is completely safe and can make the apps that use them more efficient.

    re Services:
    Often a user says he is not using certain services or software features, i.e. says that he is not using Windows Firewall. But stopping the Windows firewall requires that the user shut it off via the Control Panel AND setting it to manual or disabled via Administrative Tools/Services. Same goes for other services such as Symantec stuff, System Restore, Automatic Updates, etc. They MUST be set to off via the application or Control Panel AND in the Services applet.

    For example, I have 27 Services set to Automatic or Manual AND Started at boot. The default Windows install (XP SP2) has at least 36-40 services set to start at boot, a third of which are unnecessary unless the comp is on a Domain. Install some 3rd party apps and one can easily have 50+ services loading at boot!
     
    Last edited: 2006/10/06
    TonyT,
    #26
  8. 2006/10/06
    charlesvar

    charlesvar Inactive Alumni

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    Looked at a system roughly resembling your setup - its DSL + cable (two location, this a Laptop).

    Went thru a series of timings with BootVs and sure enough, ZA zclient timed out to about 90 seconds.

    Zones: 1 Network > LinkSys Router
    2 Internet - one for Cable, one for DSL

    For time being I would leave it alone.

    For the Internet folder question, I posted above that I would clear it all out. But since I posted that thinking zclient's time was too long, in light of timings with the Laptop - looks like its not.

    Regards - Charles
     
    charlesvar,
    #27
  9. 2006/10/06
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    Thanks Charles and TonyT.

    I'll leave the networks alone, and I'll leave the internet log files alone, too.

    Interestingly, I just shaved 35-40 seconds off my bootup time by shutting down 8 or so more services, leaving only 29 running (plus 9 more related to Symantec's Norton AntiVirus). I've now got a total bootup time of one minute.

    Not bad. This discussion has reduced my bootup time by half!

    But I'm still wondering about all that stuff in system properties about virtual memory, whether performance is weighted towards programs or system cache, etc.

    Also, it was recommended above that I "backup" before I delete the "account unknown" in user accounts. I just want to double check -- does that mean creating a restore point? Will that restore the account if for some reason the "account unknown" is in fact needed?

    Finally, I'm happy to delete my temp folder contents, in both user account/temp and windows/temp. However, both of these contain numerous subdirectories -- in user account/temp, some of them contain files related to Norton and other programs; in windows/temp, I've also got NAV sub folders as well as folders for cookies and history -- and I'm unsure if all these are safe or wise to delete.

    Opinions on the above?
     
    Last edited: 2006/10/06
    dkline,
    #28
  10. 2006/10/06
    Whiskeyman Lifetime Subscription

    Whiskeyman Inactive Alumni

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    I don't know about the Norton temp files. On my PC using Panda I deleted the temp files and ended up with the anti-virus program corrupted. It seemed for some reason that Panda placed these files there to use for scanning/protecting the temp folder.
     
    Whiskeyman,
    #29
  11. 2006/10/06
    mattman

    mattman Inactive Alumni

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    If things seem to be improving, don't rock the boat :) Keep it in the back of your mind and consider it if you seem to develop problems that could be related to that area. If you plan on deleting it, take it seriously in case something does go wrong. System Restore is not a backup. It will return Windows system files and settings back to what they were at the restore point, but it has no control over third party programs and their settings. Maybe the user account only contains the tools used by the Symantec tech, but if there registry links or links to programs there it could be like deleting a program's folder, rather than uninstalling it (sometimes problematic, sometimes not).

    Can you try accessing the folders for it using the administrator's account?

    I would suggest leaving it alone unless things turn bad.

    If you don't have a backup system look at developing one. System Restore will only reverse simplistic changes in the system. It will not protect your drive or the data on it or save the system from catastrophic changes.

    Matt
     
    mattman,
    #30
  12. 2006/10/06
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    Thanks, mattman.

    I do in fact have a full backup and disaster recovery program -- PC Backup from Stompsoft. But how would I know what to restore if by deleting that unknown user account bad stuff starts happening?

    Btw, what do you mean by "accessing the folders for" that unknown user account? I'm the administrator, so I can do anything I want. I just need to know what that is.
     
    dkline,
    #31
  13. 2006/10/06
    mattman

    mattman Inactive Alumni

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    If I am imagining correctly...
    open Windows Explorer
    open the branch for My Computer (click on the +)
    open the branch for Documents and Settings
    the user folders should be listed (Administrator, your user folder and "unknown ")

    Compare the unknown's folders to the Adminstrator's (they look to be around the same size). Application Data and Start Menu will probably be the ones to check. See if there appears to be programs there that do not on appear in the Administrator's. You may be able to uninstall any of those programs using Add or Remove Programs in the administrators account.

    I have not dabbled much further. This may let you see what is there though.

    See if this helps:
    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/312131/en-us

    Matt
     
    mattman,
    #32
  14. 2006/10/07
    onclejean Lifetime Subscription

    onclejean Inactive

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    Boot time "normal" range

    Your boot time is reasonable with NAV loading. If you have a well kept system you should not need to reboot often so what is one minute to wait?:confused:

    If you are doing a task that requires frequent reboots then temporarily disable everything not needed for that task:- CodeStuff Starter is good for this purpose http://codestuff.mirrorz.com/
    Don't use Bootviz it is counter productive in XP.:(
    If you have a small startup load the best way to keep your startup time short is regular defragmentation with a good defragger like Perfect Disk or DiskKeeper
     
    Last edited: 2006/10/07
    onclejean,
    #33
  15. 2006/10/07
    TonyT

    TonyT SuperGeek Staff

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    re the %UserProfile\Local Settings\Temp% dir:

    It is safe to delete the contents of this dir including ALL sub folders and files. Any program that utilizes this dir should be capable of recreating any files and dirs it has placed there.

    The exception is if one deletes the Temp dir itself. Windows will NOT recreate a Temp dir upon logon or reboot like it will if one deletes the Temporary Internet Files dir or the History or Recent dirs.

    If you have a program that uses this Temp dir, and the program is one that runs at very low levels, such as antivirus or firewalls, then delete the Temp dir contents while in Safe Mode or when ALL of the program's processes have beeen killed and not running. If you delete the Temp contents and a program that uses it is still running, then yes, it is possible that some corruption will occur.

    I use a script to cleanup certain dirs periodically w/ no side effects. Note, some apps that use these dirs will prevent the deletion of the dir itself and the index.dat files, but there is no harm that can come from using the script:

    Copy into a Notepad window and Save As "cleanup.cmd ". Only works w/ XPPro by default because taskkill.exe is not included w/ XPHome.
    Code:
    taskkill /f /im explorer.exe
RD /S/q  "%UserProfile%\Local Settings\Temporary Internet Files "
RD /S/q  "%UserProfile%\Cookies "
RD /S/q  "%UserProfile%\Local Settings\History "
RD /S/q  "%UserProfile%\Recent "
RD /S/q   "%UserProfile%\Local Settings\Temp\ "
MD  "%UserProfile%\Local Settings\Temp\ "
pause
start explorer.exe
    The RD command = Remove Directory. Windows or Internet Explorer automatically recreates the removed dirs. The MD command = Make Directory & is necessary to recreate the Temp dir because windows does not automatically recreate that dir.
     
    TonyT,
    #34
  16. 2006/10/07
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    Okay, I'm getting closer to understanding all this, but still I have a few questions:

    1) First, I think I mis-spoke previously when I talked about how many user accounts I have. In reality, I have three "User Profiles" under the "Advanced" tab of System Properties -- Account Unknown (33.5 MB), DKLINE/Administrator (33.2 MB), and DKLINE/David Kline (2.39 GB). But under the User Accounts section in Control Panel, I appear to have only two accounts -- David Kline (Computer administrator) and Guest (guest account is off). How do user profiles and user accounts relate to each other? And am I correct in assuming that my user accounts are actually okay and that I do NOT have any unnecessary or deletable user accounts?

    2) Under documents and settings, I have the following folders, some of which appear to relate to user accounts:

    * Administrator
    * All Users
    * David Kline
    * David Kline.DKLINE
    * Default User
    * LocalService
    * NetworkService
    * Owner

    Each of the above folders has its own Local Settings folder, and within each of these, a temp folder as well (although the temp folders in LocalService and NetworkService appear to be empty).

    3) So which temp folders in which Documents and Settings folders is it safe and useful to delete the contents of?

    4) And which of the above folders really represents a user account? Administrator is obviously one. But which of the following two folders really refers to my David Kline (Computer Administrator) account -- "David Kline" or "David Kline.DKLINE "? (Dkline, btw, is the name I've given my computer on our little home network.) And, to judge from the Microsoft knowledgebase article cited above, is "Owner" a former user account created during setup, and the source of the "Account Unknown" profile listed in User Profiles in the Advanced tab of System Properties?

    5) Should I try to delete "Owner" or any of the other Documents and Settings folders? Should I delete the contents of the temp folders in any or all of the above Documents and Settings folders? And should I delete the "Account Unknown" in the User Profiles button of the Advanced tab of System Properties?

    Sorry I keep asking questions, but it is a bit confusing.

    P.S. Is Diskkeeper or Perfect Disk a qualitatively-better defragger than the default defragger in XP, or should I just use the latter?
     
    Last edited: 2006/10/07
    dkline,
    #35
  17. 2006/10/08
    mattman

    mattman Inactive Alumni

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    Your system seems to have that "bug" that is described in the knowledgebase link. It sees the Owner account as "Account Unknown" in the profiles. The HiJack log says you have SP2, sooooo, it should be fixed. Check the version of those files that are mentioned in the link. You can check the version by a doing a search, right-click on the file and select Properties.

    I don't think any of us could say what might happen if you deleted that profile. The link says that it would be deleted automatically when you went to SP1. What I was saying was that if you want to delete it, make a full system backup first (and make a restore point if you want). I would try to find out why it is there when the link says it should not be there (check the file versions and maybe do further research at the MS KB). That was the first and most specific result I found, but there were many pages of results (my search was...Account Unknown...in Windows XP).

    ------------------------------------------------------------
    A maybe...
    The Symantech tech did a reinstall of Windows. That can result in extra (defunct) folders being created in Documents and Settings. Clean out the Temp, TIF, Cookie, etc folders and just leave them there. As Tony T said, if you delete the wrong thing it won't be recreated.

    As Tony T was saying, you can delete anything inside say, a Temp or TIF folder, you can't delete the folder/directory itself.

    Matt
     
    Last edited: 2006/10/08
    mattman,
    #36
  18. 2006/10/08
    charlesvar

    charlesvar Inactive Alumni

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    Hi dkline,

    Either DK or Perfect Disk is better than XP's, which BTW, DK wrote for MS. Both can be scheduled to run in the background.

    IMO, if you're not on the "edge" with HD space or there is not a lot of file churning causing heavy fragmentation, XP's is good enough. Supprisingly, it seems quite a few users don't bother doing defrags for very long periods of time. I recently ran into a system that hadn't been defragged for over a year.

    Regards - Charles
     
    charlesvar,
    #37
  19. 2006/10/09
    TonyT

    TonyT SuperGeek Staff

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    Your comp has 4 accounts:
    * Administrator
    * David Kline
    * David Kline.DKLINE
    * Owner

    The Owner account may or may not be related to the bug described. The Owner account could very well be an account created during an OEM XP install. (if the xp install was done by the manufacturer, i.e. Dell, Compaq, HP, etc) A default xp install from a MS XP cd or dvd creates ONE account during the install and one must give a name to this account; and this account is a member oif the Admin group.

    The script I posted will cleanup the account that one is logged in as when run.

    You can safely delete the dirs and contents of dirs of other accounts when logged in as Admin or an Admin user. Just remember to create a NEW Temp dir if delete the entire dir. No need to create Temp Internet Files, History, Recent & Cookies dirs, windows will auto create these dirs when THAT user logs on and/or Internet Explorer is first run.
     
    TonyT,
    #38
  20. 2006/10/09
    dkline

    dkline Inactive Thread Starter

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    Thanks, Tony. But if I have the four accounts you stated, then why under User Accounts in Control Panel do I only show two -- David Kline (Computer Administrator) and Gues (turned off)?
     
    dkline,
    #39
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