Window 2000- Cleaning up

In trying to improve the sluggishness of our small network (obsolecensce is not far ahead), I am trying to make more room on our harddrive. One of our programs, MRI by Intuit, has become slower than snails. Our HDD is split into 2 logical drives, one (c drive) for programs and one for data (C drive). C drive, the smaller of the two is down to 1.8Gb free out of 6.5Gb. The D drive has over 10Gb free.

1. Can I safely move the contents of the C/WNNT/Installer folder over to D drive for safe keeping?
2. Can I safely move the uninstall folders in C root to D drive, as well, for safe keeping?

I have already done the usual cleanup and defrag. I have also already upped the comm equip to a Gigabit (from server to workstation). Pinged the server from the workstation (TTL=128) and tracert (<1ms). Seems good (but I am no expert, however, esp on network stuff.). Figure all that is left is trying to give the program drive a little more elbow room.

Thanks, Lar

 

Hi Larry

Moving those files could lead to a managment nightmare later? I would not do it.

Perhaps you need to give more info on the slowdown you are experiencing.

Does the program you mentioned run as slow when run directly on the server? Is the program a 16Bit or 32Bit windows program?

What Virus scanner and firewall are you using? And have they been recently updated?

What processes are running and what does Taskmgr have to say about the average CPU load?

Finally on the cleanups, what did you do.

Did you go thru Add/remove and uninstall all old and/or unnecessary programs. Also Add/remove Windows components?

Did you look thru the Root and Program Files for programs that have no uninstall in Add/Remove.

And did you use the tools to clean deeply like the below:

D/L install and run ATF-Cleaner clear all except passwords in all browsers you have. Run repeatedly until no more found.
http://www.majorgeeks.com/ATF_Cleaner_d4949.html

D/L and install CCleaner: Clean temps and registry. Run both (temp and registry) repeatedly until no more found.
Get the Slim at bottom http://www.ccleaner.com/download/builds

Also http://www.diskcleaner.nl/support.php

Clean and update Java
Cleanup old Java and update to newest version this program will do it all for you.

Download JavaRa http://prm753.bchea.org/JavaRa.html
Unzip it, run it, cleanup old versions then use the update, chose Jucheck first and if you do not have Jucheck then chose Update using Sun..

Finally get autostart-and-process-viewer
http://www.konradp.com/products/autostart-and-process-viewer/download/apv_setup.exe

Use it for a day or so and watch for memory hogs both Physical and virtual.

Mike

 

Hi Mike,

I did move those files temporarily to see if the program in question ran any better. It did not so they will go back to their original locations.

The slowdown is mainly this program, MRI by Intuit. Every aspect is slow... even opening the program on the workstation. The Server is just used for data storage. MRI insists that it must be the server-workstation "conduit" and I asked if it could be the workstation.... to no avail. So, I have been focusing on the "conduit" and the server. Other programs work adequately fast but most are not as demanding as MRI (a big mama of a program). Also of note, MRI bogs down on more than one workstation in the same way. However, if you log in at the server, it is lighting quick! An IT tech told me that in order to really test the Gigabit connection, a sniffer needs to be used (by a techie) to ck the packets. Do you anything about this?

16bit or 32bit, don't know. I will find out on Monday. Critical?

Antivirus and weekly clean up is via Norton, Firewall is hardware via the 2-Wire firewall/router.

Maintenance is accomplished with CCleaner, and Spybot S&D 1.6. Not much, if anything, is ever found as no one uses the server, per se, for surfing. Occ Alexa or Doubleclick, that's about it. I do occassionally run jv16 for reg cleaning but not much if found there, too.

Program-wise, both the workstation and server are very lean and mean.

The XP PRo workstations that I upgraded to 1Gb of RAM are thoroughly maintained and defragged. I also increased the VM to 1.5x/min - 2x/max. Nothing helped. They are about 5 years old and though I asked MRI if their technical age is causing issues, they insisted that they weren't. HDD in the workstation has 40% free space (15Gb) so that should be ok.

I have also viewed both the sever and the workstation in HijackThis 2.02 and found nothing remarkable, and viewed their startup lists via Spybot. Unchecked a few unnecessaries but, again, to no avail.

Haven't done JavaRa yet. Can't believe that that would be that critical (though certainly helpful).

The process viewer might be the next step. Does it create a log of sorts or does it have to be observed realtime.

Nothing that I have done has made an iota of improvement. It's like having an old smoking Rambler, but it's as clean as a whistle!!

Your suggestions are greatly appreciated. Lar

 

Hi Larry

As for the JavaRa it will usually release multi megs of old java, and clear any conflicts between versions. So it is addressing 2 of your issues free disk space and performance.

I advise you do it and the other cleanups I linked as the programs go deeper than most and find the the mini dumps cr?pped out ziped and compressd files etc.

Possibly but I think you would have a lot of other issues if so.

By that do you mean that it in fact does run OK on some workstations?

Do this and get back to me with detailed results!

Boot your slowest of all workstation into Safe Mode Networking. The Video will be ugly but let me know what kind of response you get from this application!

If that works and the performance is good that alone will clear the network as an issue.

Only if the above works continue below.

Next test: please do the above first.

Boot this worst case computer back to normal. Turn off/disable the Virus scanner not just the online active scanner but the entire virus scanner.

Repeat the performance test with the program. Then turn the Firewall off if not already disable by the above if it is a Suite. If not a Suite the it should be the Windows Firewall.

Report back!

Mike

 

Hi Mike,

1. Ran all cleanup programs requested. No change.

2. Tried to run MRI in Safe Mode Networking but came up with an error.

3. Only 2 workstations (identical specs) are running MRI and they are equally slow.

4. No software firewalls.

5. Have not done the performance test yet. Did you mean AutoStart + Prococess Reviewer? If so, how do I monitor it?

Thanks, Lar

 

OK Larry​

Some programs will not run in Safe Mode they require other windows services not running in Safe Mode.​

The Process viewer is simple to use has a log can be put in startup or started automatically.​

If left running for a while it will give the average CPU usage for each program or service. Very easy to use. ​

When it opens click Processes TAB this will show all processes, then click the CPU tab twice to bring all busy programs to the top. ​

After it has run a while click the Info TAB. This gives you a general view of CPU and RAM usage. For details click full report. ​

First is listed RAM and PageFile usage. Then a list of autostart programs, then Processes with the average RAM, PAGEFILE and CPU usage for all processes since AVP started. Very simple.​

So here is how to do it:​

Just start AVP and run for a few minutes while using your problem program. Then go to the report copy and paste the contents back here.​

Then since the program will not run in Safe Mode we need to do a CLEANBOOT to clear all programs except programs necessary to run XP.​

Here is how to do that:​

Cleanboot Windows XP:
Go here use this procedure to clean boot with no startups. May be a good idea to print this.​

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/310353​

Do steps 1-8.​

Then reboot and test the program, if issue is not gone now. Reverse the msconfig and let me know! Uh Oh!

If your issue does not exist then run APV again while running your program and paste this log back. We will need this to see the difference and pinpoint the actual culprit.​

reenable only #2 and 3 first.​

Reboot retest​

All OK, then reverse 4 5 6 7 to get back to normal.​

Reboot​

This should put us back to normal.

Your Ball!​

Mike​

 

Hi Mike,

Here are the results from the Autostart Full Report. Sadly, the cleanboot had zero effect. Your instructions were fantatsic., though!!

 

Uh Larry

Where is the Slow Program (MRI by Intuit)??

In this list nothing is actually executing Recent CPU usage: 0 %??????

And if it weren't for Norton you would hardly have anything running.

Some one needs to put MRI thu some paces so it has a history.

Do it this way:

Do the Clean Boot again then run APV 1st and then the (MRI by Intuit) but the MRI program needs to have done some processing etc while AVP is watching!!!

Mike

 

Hi Mike,

The starting processes of login screen, splash screen, opening program panel are sooooo slooooow and have not improved one iota (make that 0.5 iotum) through all this. What might be shown by putting MRI through it's paces and taxing the workstation's resources?

Thanks, Lar

 

Larry..Larry​

Tho you did say the computer needed to be updated never did you say the computer was slow in general. You seemed to indicate that the MRI program was slow specifically.​

Of course if the entire computer is slow on everything it will carry!​

Well at least now I know. And my answer you will not like!​

But if you humor me on this we will likely get your computer running satisfactorily.​

From looking at what did show I believe it is Norton. Un-installing Norton will prove this.​

I will not ask you to do anything complex or that can not be reversed.​

Most people know Norton is a severe slow down, but don't realize that just having Norton installed on the system incurs this slowdown. ​

As you noticed even with a clean boot! Just being on the computer even disabled. Want proof un-install it correctly.​

But first before you do that lets tweak every thing else.​

Do all all the below while running in normal (not clean boot mode).​

Next:​

Clean and tweak services​

In services stop and disable all of the below just to get them out of the way for now for trouble shooting purposes. ​

Nothing is un-installed or deleted only disabled from running!​

They can be put back anytime later but I would not, as none of them are needed by most home users and very few business users. Basically stuff M$ thought you should have.​

Disabled uses no memory (RAM) and no CPU cycles.
Manual uses the RAM but a small amount of CPU.
Auto and not started they use even more RAM and CPU.
Auto and started even more RAM and CPU ..​

Now in this case we are disabling for trouble shooting purposes. But when we finish if you leave them all off until it is noticed that you need one (not likely for 99%) then it can be enabled.​

Leaving these all off, then becomes a performance tweak/boost as they free some RAM and CPU cycles! Special note. If you are going to pick and choose then be aware that the small amount of RAM and CPU cycles of each one individually is not significant but as a group it is! So if you need most of them (or just think you do because you don't) then just as well enable them all)!​

DNS Client
Fast User switching
Indexing service
Messenger
Net logon (Leave this one if logging on to a DC)
Net.TCP Port Sharing
NetMeeting Remote Desktop Sharing
IPsec services
QoS RSVP
Remote Registry
Uninterruptable power supply
Universal Plug and play
Web Client
Windows media player Network Sharing​

IF

you are using a wired network card and "NOT" using wireless on this computer then you can ​

also disable ​

Wireless Zero configuration​

This is only used on computers with a wireless NIC like a Laptop. Do not disable Wireless Zero configuration on a Laptop. Has nothing to do with other wireless hardware like wireless routers etc.​

In short if this computer has a CAT 5 or 6 cable and no ability to connect wirelessly if that cable is unplugged, then you can disable Wireless Zero configuration.​

This is not to be confused with Wired Auto Config do not disable that!​

When above is finished reboot and test MRI also take note of boot time and time to desktop. There should be improvement but this is not all the fix.​

You should notice some improvement!​

Now to un-install (most of) Norton:​

To get a deeper cleaner un-install D/L Revo ​

http://www.revouninstaller.com/revosetup.exe​

Run it click view to show details. Then find Norton rt click and click un-install, then check Advanced-next are you sure=yes wait for un-install then click next, then next again.

On the Leftover Registry items click ONLY the Bold items and Delete. If the screen shows remaining Keys with + then click the + to drill down to a BOLDED item or items and remove them.​

When screen is blank click next if it shows Remaining Files select all and delete. ​

Next: Look for any remaining separate Norton or Symantec (typically Live Update etc) entries and use the same procedure​

When finished Reboot.​

Run CCleaner Temp and Registry to finish a few more Norton/Symantec registry entries.​

Now test MR!​

Mike​

 

Hi Mike, you are a man of great patience. Thanks.

Before I get started with "the list "....

What did I say that made you think that the computer is running slow in general?

Larry

 

Larry!

What are you drinking, stick to water for a while!

From your last post

What else am I supposed to think?!

And the "list" is not as complex as it looks. The Service Tweaks can be done on Server if you wanted and is advised but 99% of the slowness of MRI is at the Workstation level. Still no indication of Network hardware.

Mike

 

Hi Mike,

A nice Merlot from Sonoma County, thank you! LOL

I just meant by the "slooooo statement" that MRI's opening was still very slow and unchanged, not that everyelse was (still) slow too.

But, one can never give Norton enough credit.

Larry

 

So you are going to do the process?

Mike

 

Absolutely! Later this afternoon (PDT).

Lar

 

Hi Mike, I was looking over the list of things to do and have 2 questions.

1. Could I (or should I) try to uninstall Norton first?

2. When I do the removal and, by chance, find that there is no benefit to running MRI, how do I re-install? It was a downloaded program from Symantec.

Lar

 

Well you could uninstall Norton first. But I would do the Tweaks first.

I don't know about how to re-install I assumed you have a License! If you have the License then you can still install off the www.

Not much to worry about here you will likely be celebrating (oh no stay off the Sonoma County Merlot a little longer).

If it does solve the issue then I will help you chose a good Scanner.

Mike

 

Hi Mike, as of late I have only short time windows of opportunity with the (slowest) workstation in question. So, yesterday I uninstalled Norton via RevoUninstaller, and I did find the license for it, too. RevoUninstaller is a great program. Sadly, Norton's removal did nothing at all towards speeding up MRI. I was pretty surprised as Norton's hogginess is infamous. I will do the Tweaks next. Larry

 

Hi Larry

Don't jump the gun and re-install Norton yet because it is not all gone, and untill we get a little more diags.

Did you also uninstall Liveupdate if not do that then continue below.

D/L and Run the Norton removal tool:
ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/removal_tools/Norton_Removal_Tool.exe

Reboot before continuing below.

Then D/L and install Regseeker http://www.hoverdesk.net/freeware.htm

Click find in Registry

Find and delete
Norton
symantec
Liveupdate

Then do a Windows search using Advanced Options (Search System Folders, Hidden Fles and Folders, Subfolders) for Norton*.* then syman*.* then liveup*.* delete all found.

Reboot and run a general Registry clean with CCleaner and/or Regseeker.

Now you are 99.9% free of Norton!

Retest for issue.

Mike

 

For Clarity I decided to make this a seperate post.

To help protect LarryB's As* now and later, add a Registry backup now on both.

ERUNT Registry backup http://www.larshederer.homepage.t-online.de/erunt/
Install let it add entry to Startup and let it back up now.

I would do the Services tweaks I advised earlier (except DNS Client) on the Server also. Remember they can easily be turned back on.

Now do these tweaks on both the Server and workstation.
http://www.speedguide.net/read_articles.php?id=1607

To be sure these are all in effect both computers need to be rebooted, so do the workStation first and reboot. Then when possible reboot server.

If you get improvement by doing the above on the XP WorkStation you should get more when the Server has them and rebooted.

Mike