Networking to Win95 computer -- had it, lost it

I have a Windows XP computer, and an older Windows 95 computer. Both are connected successfully to a Linksys wireless router, and both can access the internet being fed into that router.

I've wanted to have file transfer capability between these two computers. So today I went to the XP's network setup wizard, and established a "workgroup" that was the same for both computers. I shared some folders on the Windows 95 computer, and low and behold, they showed up in My Network Places on the XP computer. I even moved some files from the Windows 95 to the XP computer. "Wow," I thought, "That was easier than I expected it to be."

But I should have known better. I next wanted to check if I could access shared folders on the XP computer, and when I went to the Network Neighborhood on the Win95 one, I couldn't see them. So I started trying things, and to make a long story short, now I cannot get the original networking to work anymore. The XP computer cannot see the Windows 95. I've messed with it for 2 1/2 hours, and tried different settings, tried rebooting both computers, tried different ways of entering passwords on the Win95 computer, and I'm not making progress. Both computers still can access the internet, so I know the networking hardware is still working okay.

I'm hoping that someone here has experience networking Win95 to XP and can tell me the right things to do. I'm getting nowhere.

Terry

 

Hi Terry,

I recommend that you don't use 'File and Printer Sharing' in Network Properties. There are plenty of risks involved.
Read this: http://cable-dsl.home.att.net/netbios.htm

But, I also understand how important it is to get files from one computer to the other on your network. Just use one of the instant messaging programs. I use MSN Messnger to transfer any file to and/or from any computer.

If you still insist on using 'File and Printer Sharing', have a look at the following:
http://www.careyholzman.com/netfixes.htm
and here:
http://www.practicallynetworked.com/sharing/troubleshoot

If and when you do get everything setup the way you want and it's all working, be sure to check your network security at 'Shields UP!' https://www.grc.com/x/ne.dll?bh0bkyd2

There is plenty of information on 'File and Printer Sharing' available on the internet.
Do a search at http://www.google.com
You will get results.

Good luck,
ski123

 

Thanks for the useful links. I don't have time tonight to try them, but they do offer a lot of possibilities to try.

Regarding the security risk, I did download the patch for the Windows 95 computer I have. Thanks again.

Terry

 

Personally I wouldn't use MSN messenger to transfer files within your network. Perhaps it is because I am not a fan of Windows/MSN messenger (I've seen it used too easily by an idiot to gain access to someone elses PC), but I would not use a tool that uses a link out of your network, to transfer files to a local PC.

I'd recommend persevering with folder sharing. If you've set up your Linksys router correctly, it will prevent anyone on the internet taking advantage of some vulnerabilities that file and print sharing can expose.

Have a look at Microsoft's Guide to XP networking and see if that helps you sort out the problem.

 

Dear ReggieB,

Thanks for the vote of confidence and the extra help link. I am still trying to get connected, probably will look at it closely this weekend when I have more time. I did run the tests suggested by ski123 on access to the computer, and it does show a very high level of security, as you suggest might be the case with the Linksys router.

Terry

 

Remember that at the start of this, I was making file transfers from the Windows 95 to the XP computer, so I had it, and then lost it. But I don't even know how I lost it.

I found another useful link . . .

http://www.duxcw.com/faq/network/xprouter98.htm

and did some what it said, such as removing all connections and bindings to NetBEUI and activating the user account.

Then I relogged the Win95 computer, and as it has been doing lately, it asked for a network password. This time I gave it a blank password and confirmed that blank password. That made some difference, because before I couldn't even get it to find itself on its own network. But this time when I went to network places, it did show the shared folders that I'd made available on the Windows 95 computer.

So I went back the XP computer, but it still cannot see the Win95 computer on the same workgroup. Even after again running the network wizard, and insuring the correct workgroup was named.

This is really getting depressing. Windows is depressing.

Terry

 

I worked on it more. It seems that the problem is probably at least partly on the Win 95 computer. I started trying different settings of what controlled the password access (ie. the linksys router, Microsoft Networking, or Windows Logon). At some point there, instead of getting a three line logon screen with a place for domain, I got a 2 line logon screen, and was finally able to see the XP computer from the Win 95 one, but couldn't actually access it. I took screenprints of all the network settings, but didn't get screen prints of all the properties. At the next logon, I couldn't get the XP computer from the win95 one again.

Terry

 

Terry - way too late now (3am) but this evening I'll post some things for you to do that should get you fixed up.

 

It might also be worth going back basics to give us a better idea of how you are set up.

Can you give us the IP address, mask and gateway of the XP PC and the win95 PC? Also what do you get if you:

• Ping the 95 PC's IP address from the XP PC

• Ping the 95 PC's name from the XP PC

• Ping the XP PC's IP address from the 95 PC

• Ping the XP PC's name from the 95 PC

 

This is from the XP:

Physical Address: 00-0C-76-BD-F8-A9
IP Address: 192.168.1.100
Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway: 192.168.1.1
DHCP Server: 192.168.1.1
Lease Obtained: 8/26/2004 9:24:22 AM
Lease Expires: 8/27/2004 9:24:22 AM
DNS Servers: 137.230.1.110, 207.179.200.2, 207.179.200.10
WINS Server:


Windows 95 comuter:

Adapter address: 00-40-96-54-D8-74
IP Address: 192.168.1.102
Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway: 192.168.1.1

I'll check the pings next.

Terry

 

Pinging

Here are the four pings. At this point, it looks like there is no communication between the two computers. (at other times/settings there obviously was, however it doesn't seem to be consistent).



***Ping the 95 PC's IP address from the XP PC

C:\Documents and Settings\Terry>ping 192.168.1.102

Pinging 192.168.1.102 with 32 bytes of data:

Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.102:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 0, Lost = 4 (100% loss),




***Ping the 95 PC's name from the XP PC

C:\Documents and Settings\Terry>PING ZORO
Ping request could not find host ZORO. Please check the name and try again.


***Ping the XP PC's IP address from the 95 PC

C:\WIN95>ping 192.168.1.100

Pinging 192.168.1.100 with 32 bytes of data:

Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Request timed out.

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.100:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 0, Lost = 4 (100% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 0ms, Maximum = 0ms, Average = 0ms


*** Ping the XP PC's name from the 95 PC


C:\WIN95>ping zeus
Unknown host zeus.

 

Ah! that explains it. Terry - you've been looking in the wrong place.

Your IP settings look right. Both have the same mask. The part of the IP address under the 255s is the same:

255.255.255.0
192.168.1.x

And the part under the 0 is unique to each PC and in the range 1 to 254 - again this is as it should be.

As you are getting "Request timed out." responses to pings at the most basic TCP/IP level (the IP address), there is something wrong at a very basic level.

I expect you have a dodgy network cable. However, the problem could also be a faulty network card, or the router at fault, but I'd start at the cables.

There is another test you can try. Try pinging the router from each PC by using the command:

ping 192.168.1.1

I think there will be four possible outcomes to this test

1. Both PCs get "Request timed out "
2. Only the XP PC gets a response from the router
3. Only the 95 PC gets a response from the router
4. Both PCs get a response

If 1. the problem is probably the router
If 2. the problem is with the 95 PC (or possibly the port on the router to which the 95 PC is connected). Swap cables and retest. If you now get outcome 3, it is the cable at fault. Otherwise either the 95 PCs network card or the port on the router (try different port on the router and see what that does)
If 3. the problem is with the XP PC (or possibly the port on the router to which the XP PC is connected). Do the same as suggested above for the 95 PC
If 4 try the original tests. This may be an intermittent fault and you may have to do it a few times to pick up the problem.

If you still can't fix the problem, post back with a report of what you did and the results and we'll scratch our heads again.

 

Reggie,

Thanks for the input. I've got to leave for work now, so I won't have time to test this until tonight. But a couple of observations may be helpful:

While the test last night that you refer does allow for the possibility of hardware or cable problems, there is other data that suggests otherwise. As I noted at the outset of the thread, both computers are able to directly access the internet, and that continues to be the case right through to now.

The XP is ethernet cabled directly into a Linksys router (which gets its internet feed by cable from an ADSL modem). The Win95 also is still working well on the internet (I've been e-mailing files between the computers as I do these diagnostics). It is connected via a Cisco 340 wireless card, no cable, transmitting and receiving to the Linksys wireless router by radio. Throughout this whole diagnostic episode, the connections to the internet have both worked flawlessly. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but this seems to indicate to me that my problem is not due to hardware or cabling.

Also supporting that likelihood that I don't have a raw connection problem is the fact that as I diddle and putz around with software settings, I sometimes seem to get at least partially connected between the two computers, to the extent that I can see the existence of the other computer in the Network Places. It just happened that when I did these tests above, I was not able to see anything on the other computers no matter which computer I was on.

But sometimes, when I fool around with these settings, I have been able to see the other computer in the "My Network" area. When that happened most recently I was not able to do anything with the other computer. But recall that when I first started, I was able to actually transfer some files over the network from the Windows 95 computer to the XP, thought I couldn't at that time see the XP from the 95 (but later could). Then I lost it (hence the title of this thread), even though I was never able to go the other way.

My guess is that I have a software setting wrong or some conflict somewhere, and I expect it is on the Win95 computer. If I can get the partial connection that I sometimes have achieved restored, I'll re-run these ping tests, and I expect we'll see more useable information. Also, this weekend I'll try to capture some screenshots of various settings on the computers, and upload that here to see if there is some obvious settings mistakes. It seems like there are numerous possibilities for me to be screwing something up in that regard.

If I'm wrong on my reasoning on this, please don't be shy about letting me know.

Thanks again for your interest in my problem.

Terry

 

pinging router

I did have enough time to ping the router from the XP:


C:\Documents and Settings\Terry>ping 192.168.1.1

Pinging 192.168.1.1 with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time=1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time<1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time<1ms TTL=64
Reply from 192.168.1.1: bytes=32 time<1ms TTL=64

Ping statistics for 192.168.1.1:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 0ms, Maximum = 1ms, Average = 0ms


I have to shut everything off now, because we are in a thunderstorm. I'll do the same on the other computer tonight.

Terry

 

Good point about the access to the internet suggesting it is not a cable fault. I'd forgotten that point from your initial posting.

My thinking was that you were seeing an intermittent cable problem and misinterpreting this as due to the settings changes you were making at the same time.

However, I'd still recommend that you correct this problem from the bottom up. That is start at the very basic level first and then work your way up to the most complicated.

The basic level to start with is IP (you can go lower, but this is the usual point to start). So I'd recommend doing the following:

1. Ping ip - Get your network working at the IP level. There is no point messing around with file sharing and permissions, or group membership if you cannot even get a ping to work. To get this to work you need your IP addresses working correctly, network cards set up correctly, and router functioning correctly.
2. Ping name - Once things are working at the IP level, next thing to look at is the network names systems. Test this by pinging by name. Factors that effect this are correct DNS set up and NetBIOS. Typical problems can be duplicate PC names and incorrectly configured DNS settings.
3. Work on file sharing - Once you have the systems pinging each other by name, then look at the file sharing system.

At the moment you are at 1. Interesting that one of the PCs is connecting via Wireless. This could be a bridging problem. The router may not be bridging between the wireless and cable networks correctly.

 

Which version of Win95 is being used ?

I never could get the original Win95 to work properly. but 95b ( OSR2 ) worked just fine.

But now I can't realy help with 95 as everything is 98 SE or XP Home or XP Pro.

BillyBob

 

Solved it, finally (I hope)

(I am running 95b.)

I've finally got the two working together, can even print from the Win95 to the XP's printer.

The cause of all the problems (I'm pretty sure) was dueling firewalls. In one of the links above, they recommend turning off all firewalls. I had explicitely turned of the one that comes with XP, and I thought I had the one (Outpost) on the Win95 computer deactivated also.

But Reggie's comments got me thinking about the router settings, and while I was looking at them, I found that there was yet a third firewall set by the Linksys Router. I turned that off, and nothing good happened. But then I checked XP and found that its firewall had crept back on. When I shut it off, the computers got un-constipated and stuff started flowing in both directions.

I then set Outpost to recognize the other computers specifically by IP number, kept XP's off, and turned the one on the router back on, and everything is still working okay, even after a reboot. I'll re-check the internet security of the XP again, but I think I've finally found the problem.

Thanks for everyone's advice and help. It led me to the right solution.

Terry

 

Glad to read that you got things working again.

As to the Printer.

I myself have gone to a NETWORK printer that plugs directly into the Router.

I was using a Shared Printer for a long time but ran into problems such as you had along with the fact that this XP machine had to be on at all times so that others could print. Now it makes no difference.

Just recently my Son came home with a PC using XP Home and had a NIC already. We just plugged it into my Router, installed the Printer drivers and he was on his way. And we purposely left all other machines off.

Is this something ( Router Firewall ) that is in a newer model ? Or am I missing something ? I know my Linksys Router has NAT but I am not aware of a Firewall.

BillyBob

 

I purchased the router around the first of this year. It is a model WRT54G. In the setup there is a "security" screen with an option to enable or disable firewall protection, and a checkmark to activate "Block Anonymous Internet Requests." That is all I know about it.

Terry

 

Thank you

I now see where the difference is. You have a newer and different Model Router.

I have an older BEFSR41.

BillyBob