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A very quick ... ??? ... full format

Discussion in 'PC Hardware' started by Christer, 2005/09/15.

  1. 2005/09/15
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    Hello all!

    Yesterday, I installed a new system based on Gigabyte GA-K8VM800M and two Hitachi 7K250 SATA. During the installation of XP, after having created the system partition (C: ~30 GB) only, I told it to format (full NTFS). I got out of my seat to get a cup of coffee but to my surprise, the format procedure took only a few seconds. I sat down again with jaw dropped ...... :confused: ...... forgot about the coffee!

    When the installation had finished, I went to Disk Manager, moved the opticals to X: and Y: respectively and created an extended partition with a logical volume (D: ~120 GB) of the unallocated space. I formated (full NTFS), it took less than 30 seconds ...... :eek: ...... jaw dropped further!

    I connected a second identical HDD, in Disk Manager I created an extended partition with two logical volumes (E: ~120 GB + F: ~30 GB). I denied formating the first one until both had been created. Then formated (full NTFS), one after the other. It took the usual time (approximately one hour for both volumes).

    Now, I suspected gremlins ...... :rolleyes: ...... jaw firmly up and teeth grinding! I reformated D: (full NTFS) and it took the normal time (approximately 40 minutes). This convinced me that it might be a good idea to reformat C: too and reinstall.

    I could have spared me the trouble because it again took only a few seconds to format (full NTFS). This is not only confusing but also a bit worrying.

    Any comments?

    Thanks for Your time,
    Christer
     
    Christer,
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  2. 2005/09/15
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    I have created the first Ghost Image, Partition-to-Image, of C: to F:. It was successful and the Image passed the integrity check. C: seems to be OK since Ghost didn't complain ...... :) ...... !

    Christer
     
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  4. 2005/09/15
    oshwyn5

    oshwyn5 Inactive

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    I have seen sometimes in NTFS that when you tell it to format a drive (or partition) previously formatted in NTFS all it does is rebuild the Master File Table (MFT) and not actually reformat the drive.
    Is this what happened?
    Is any of your old data still present?
    This is because NTFS is a file based format. Each file (or cluster containing part of a file) contains a copy of the Master File Table entry for the file. Sometimes format just goes forth and queries the files and rebuilds the MFT. IN fact NTFS keeps a backup copy of the MFT and sometimes will just replace the original with the backup when you try to format.
     
    oshwyn5,
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  5. 2005/09/15
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    Both HDDs were brand new, unused.

    On my second attempt to format C:, it was used and contained a NTFS file system and Windows XP.

    My first thought was that the harddisk was unused and that was the explanation for bypassing something during the formating procedure. "Something" would be the cluster check which takes place during a full format but not a quick format. I actually expected the second attempt to format to take the normal time to complete. The reason for my expectation was that it had been used and contained data.

    Christer
     
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  6. 2005/09/15
    oshwyn5

    oshwyn5 Inactive

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    I always delete all partitions and create new ones when I want a "clean" format in ntfs.
    Did you use the drive manufacturers software to partion and prepare the drive before you did this format? If so , it probably was already formatted based on factory settings.
     
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  7. 2005/09/15
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    No, Hitachi don't have any. They recommend using the Windows utilities (during installation from the CD and from within XP - Disk Manager). They have a Drive Fitness Test and other utilities. The DFT can wipe the disk, overwriting it with zeros.

    I wonder if/how a new harddisk is initialized during installation (from the CD). No prompt about that but when I connected the second harddisk and went to Disk Manager, I was prompted to initialize that one.

    No matter what, this is the first time I experience this behaviour. Even if a formating procedure has been finished seconds ago, doing it again should take it from square one and go through the whole procedure again ...... :confused: ...... right?

    Christer
     
    Last edited: 2005/09/15
    Christer,
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  8. 2005/09/16
    mattman

    mattman Inactive Alumni

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    Hi Christer,
    I don't think you have any cause for alarm either.
    A standard format does not actually delete the data, just resets the file indexing system. If you did a format the data should be recoverable until it is eventually overwritten.
    The amount of time you notice would be complexity of changing the information in the "index ".
    I have had the same experience, from 30 seconds to 1 hour. All those drives are fine.

    I would say that the Hitachi came already configured for Windows to set-up. Although I have found inconsistencies. One Hitachi and one Seagate I have bought were not recognized by the BIOS at all. After inital panic I ran the manufacturer's utilities. Both were what I call "factory formatted ", they were zero formatted and had no Boot Sectors for the BIOS to identify. They were both set up using the utilities. Other Seagates I have purchased have been "ready to go" (I have not purchased any Hitachis since then). From one of our previous threads (a question about changing the electronic card on a drive) drives of the same model may be manufactured in different places around world, so I put this inconsistency down to their being configured differently in the different manufacturing locations.

    I don't think you should have any problem with the drives. Run the manufacturer's tests if you have any suspicions.

    Matt
     
    mattman,
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  9. 2005/09/16
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    Hi Matt!

    Yes, other utilities are needed to wipe the disk (overwrite with zeros).

    The difference between "full format" and "quick format" is that the former rebuilds the FAT/MFT and checks the disk for errors but the latter only rebuilds the FAT/MFT. This is the reason for the difference in time between the two.

    I'm not worried because the disk has been reported OK by all utilities that I have thrown at it. The best test is to create a Ghost image and check the integrity.

    I still don't understand why it delivers a quick format when a full format is requested but ...... ;) ...... it's good to know that it has happened to other(s) too!

    Christer
     
    Christer,
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