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A few questions on RAID 1

Discussion in 'PC Hardware' started by Christer, 2004/07/23.

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  1. 2004/07/23
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    Hello all!

    A friend of mine had a HDD (Seagate Barracuda 7200.7) go south on him and he had no backups whatsoever. He has been told (not by me) about the option to go RAID 1 which mirrors two HDDs. If one HDD quits, the still good one soldiers on.

    Now, he has two identical HDDs, the replacement for the RMA and an additional one.

    Could someone tell me what my searches didn't reveal:

    1) When the two HDDs are installed (physically) should they both be on IDE1 or should one be on IDE1 and one on IDE2?

    I would think that separating HDDs from opticals still is a good (but debated) idea.

    The BIOS has to be setup to handle the two HDDs as RAID 1 but ......

    2) When the installation of WinXP is commenced and the HDD(s) are partitioned in C, D and E ...... :confused: ...... will both HDDs be partitioned simultaneously?

    3) Does RAID 1 have an impact on performance since reading (?) and writing occurs simultaneously from/to two HDDs?

    Well, the question is valid if both HDDs are on IDE1.

    Thanks for Your time,
    Christer
     
    Last edited: 2004/07/23
  2. 2004/07/23
    Scott Smith

    Scott Smith Inactive Alumni

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    First off you will have to have a RAID controler card, or a motherboard that supports onboard RAID.
    Promise makes an excellent line of RAID cards.

    Yes RAID 1 does reduce performance.



    You should never put 2 hard drives on the same channel if they are RAID 1.
    If one drive goes down it will bring the other down with it.



    When you create a RAID array in the RAID controller BIOS the OS will see it as one drive. In your case 1 (80) Gb drive. You can partition it however you like in windows.
     

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  4. 2004/07/23
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    My information is that his motherboard supports RAID 0 and RAID 1.

    I had a look in the price list of my local computer shop and found this RAID controller card:

    Promise TX2000 UDMA-133 PCI IDE Controller RAID 0/1, priced at SEK1095 (USD ~150)

    compared to this motherboard:

    Gigabyte GA-7N400-PRO2 with RAID on both SATA and IDE, priced at SEK1295 (USD ~170)

    Does anyone upgrade an old motherboard with a RAID controller card?

    Christer

    Edited:

    I took my system as a comparision for an upgrade (EPOX8KTA3) and I would be able to reuse the processor (AMD Thunderbird 1GHz/266MHz) but not the memory modules (SDRAM PC133) which tilt the equasion towards upgrading with a RAID controller card.
     
    Last edited: 2004/07/23
  5. 2004/07/23
    Rockster2U

    Rockster2U Geek Member

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    Beg to differ with you on this. One can put two drives on the same IDE or SATA channel and run RAID 1 without a problem. One can also put two drives on the same IDE or SATA channel and run RAID 0. Believe Christer is looking to mirror these in a RAID 1 configuration and his friend is safe either way he wants to go - different channels or same channels. Would add he should go CS on drive jumpers.

    Interesting sidebar - although I'm not running anything anymore in RAID 0, just saw some rather impressive test results that blew me away - Two drive Raid 0 configuration vs single drive - average speed increase of only 3%.

    ;)
     
  6. 2004/07/23
    Scott Smith

    Scott Smith Inactive Alumni

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    After a catastrophic hard drive failure on a stand alone server I re-thought my RAID configurations.

    4 80 gig IBM Deskstars on a Promise TX 2000 2 channel RAID card.
    the config was Mirror / Stripe ( 0 + 1 )
    The TX 2000 is a 2 channel card so there was a master / slave on each channel.
    Well when one of the mirrors failed it brought down everything.

    After speaking with Promise numerious times with no success all data was lost.

    During the conversation Promise told me for future reference to NEVER put more than one drive per channel.

    All of their upper end cards come with master only cables.
     
  7. 2004/07/24
    Rockster2U

    Rockster2U Geek Member

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    Scott:

    Not trying to start an arguement but think about it.

    Under your "advised scenario ", the only RAID cards that could support RAID 0+1 or RAID 5 would be 4 channel cards and all two channel cards would be limited to 2 drives unless you were running "JBOD" (even that would be a no-no according to what you were told). When should we start collecting settlements for all the false advertising going on throughout the industry?

    Now, your previous problem requires a brief explanation - in order to set RAID 0+1 on your Promise TX 2000 card, you had to connect the four disks to the two 2 channel controllers. Disks on the same cable (controller) formed each RAID-0 array and the RAID-1 array was formed from these two RAID-0 arrays, giving RAID 0+1. RAID 0+1 is, in essence two RAID 0 (stripes) that have been mirrored (RAID 1).

    When you lost one drive on your mirror, you lost both of them on that particular controller because they were actually in a RAID 0 configuration and that still would have happened whether you were on a dual controller card or a quad. Not necessarily a permanent loss but if one drive goes - they are both gone until the bad or failed drive is replaced. Now, if your problem was more than just single hard drive catastrophic failure, what happened is very understandable because of your RAID 0+1 configuration. (Each of the two RAID 0 arrays is identical.) If it was just single drive failure then the drives on the other (non-affected controller) (the other array) would still be totally intact and you could have simply replaced the defective drive and rebuilt your configuration.

    I don't run anything with RAID 0 anymore because I see few advantages and lots of dis-advantages - this also then rules out running 0+1. However, I do a lot with RAID 1 configurations and I always try to keep the mirrored drives on the same controller. Not that I've lost a lot of drives, but I've experienced my fair share and I've never, (repeat never) lost both drives in a pure RAID 1 configuration - thats the beauty of it. I also use removable drive bays and keep drives jumpered CS so its pretty quick to repair a mirrored array in the event of catastrophic drive failure.

    I think you got a bum steer from whomever you talked to at Promise Tech Support. We call those the NFG's - (New ****ing Guys).

    ;)
     
  8. 2004/07/24
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff Thread Starter

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    I've been informed that he has SATA drives and as I understand it, with only two SATA connectors on the motherboard, his RAID 1 will have both SATAs on the same controller.

    Another friend will help the friend in need with this issue which means that I'm not directly involved. I've thought about going RAID 1 myself on my next build (whenever that will happen) and Your discussion has been informative. If there are more aspects to concider, bring'em up!

    Thanks,
    Christer
     
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