Fatal exception - now and again?

Guys,

I occassionally get the following FE on boot-up (about every 10th boot -ish), Fatal Exception in: 0187:BFF86EBD (?). I have to reset and sometimes it either sends me into safe mode (which I now ignore and select 'normal' or Norton Scan disk activates/runs and the re-boot continues as normal.

This seems to have happened since increasing my Memory to 512mb with 2 new 256mb sticks from 'crucial' - however the memory is cleared by 'simmtester' and has been cleaned/swapped around and reseated.

Someone suggested running IE repairer for a similar issue on the forum - would this help here?

Any ideas,

Mick

 

Not much to go here - you don't even mention which OS.

My first port of call would be Microsoft and enter 0187 BFF86EBD [two words] into the Knowledge Base search. Without specifying OS I got 12 instances - have a look, you may find the answer there.

MS Support

 

Hi Mick

This is normally a memory access problem. It can be the physical RAM or Virtual memory.

You have done the swaping of the sticks and run Simtester. I am not totally comfortable with SimTester but it is better than nothing.

But it also can be other things besides memory. A disk error in the location of the windows swap file can also cause this. To be sure you must do a scandisk with surface scan.

Reinstalling or fixing IE would not hurt but don't seem to be the problem. You might consider upgrading to 98 2nd edition if convenient.

So since this may be a virtual memory problem clear the swap file.

If you are going to clear the swap, then do the rest below for a deep cleaning.

Do the steps below in the order presented and do not skip a step.

Since the last thing you should do is a scan and defrag you may want to optionally download the WinME defragger as it is more thorough and much faster.

I mention it first so you can download and copy it before the cleanups and reboots below.

Get it here: http://www.boogiejack.com/software/winmedefrag.zip

The cleanups. These are for 95 98 only!

Boot to DOS (not shutdown to DOS). While booting hit F8 to startup menu. Chose "command prompt only ".

Type these commands exactly hit enter at the end (do not type the notes that are in parenthesis like this).

del c:\*.swp (may get file not found, is ok)

del c:\windows\*.swp

deltree /y c:\windows\shelli*.*

deltree /y c:\windows\temp\*.*

deltree /y c:\windows\tempor~1\*.*

deltree /y c:\windows\history\*.*

deltree /y c:\windows\spool\printers\*.*

deltree /y c:\windows\taskmon.exe

deltree /y c:\windows\applog

NOTE: deleting of taskmon and applog above are optional and may be skipped but they are well known to be useless and actually slow a defrag and waste disk space and also rob CPU resources since it runs in memory all the time. I would clear them!
____________________________________________
Then boot to safe mode and do the following

Configure CleanMgr to max settings
Go to Start-Run and type

cleanmgr /sageset:1
the above need only be ran once (these settings will be remembered as the default until another sageset is ran).

It will present a menu select all, then

Go to Start-Run and type

cleanmgr /sagerun:1
As long as /sageset above has been ran on this computer from now on the /sagerun:1 is the only thing that needs to run.

NOW do the scan and defrag WHILE IN SAFE MODE!

These cleanups will not only possibly fix the problem but should help overall performance and stability.

mike

 

Mike,

Sorry for late reply but i've been off line for a few days.

Thanks for the in-depth tips, much appreciated - as I posted in the Win98 section I assumed people would know i'm running Win98 (se infact).

I'll give your suggestions a go as this problem is pi----g me off. Anything is worth a go - even a reformat !!! But if its a memory issue I doubt that would help???

This problem manifested after upping to 512mb from 256mb so I assume the problem may lie there ? I know 98 is touchy about excess memory above 512 (mine posts as 524) could that be problem ??

Thanks again,

Mick

 

It surely could. (512M in win98)

Since it came with the memory it is probably the problem.

If the cleanups do not do it, then remove 1 stick. If problem then goes away, then after a while switch the sticks and run with the other for a while.

If problem only with both then trade one of the sticks for a 128 and try with only 384 of memory. If it works stay with that.

If it is a memory problem then formating will not help.

2K or XP can handle and run well with 512. You may think about that.

Mike

 

Mick

Apologies re Win98 ref - I'd just left a Windows forum.

I was half way thru replying when mflynn came back.

The way virtual memory works we cannot predict what blocks of memory will be used and any request for non existent physical Ram will bring the system down. This may account for why it's not happening on every boot. Even limiting memory via the Advanced tab of msconfig will probably be no help as the 'rogue' memory may not be masked by the limiting.

Yeah, I agree with mflynn. Test each new stick and see how much Ram the system reports.

I have 384Mb, on a SE, but that is simply because I added 256 to 128. Very many more people are running with 512Mb without problem than those with problems.

Once you have 512Mb being reported you may like to limit MaxFileCache in the Vcache section of System.ini to 75% of Ram, say, 384Mb [entered in Kb, so 393216]

 

Execellent advice by gammaepsilon

Correction on my memeory reccomendation. If the problem is still there, trade one of your 256 in for one 128 and one 64 stick "IF" you have more than 2 slots. This will give you 448 of Ram and keep you under the limit.

Some 98's do work OK wiith 512 but the BIOS on some can help here. You may not have a BIOS that does.

Additionally there was some updates and patches from M$ I think that "tried" to help this.

Mike

 

Guys,

Cant thank you enough for your help - brilliant !! Apologies for any misunderstanding regarding OS.

I dont really want to drop below 512 for games use (Graphics !), i've tried variuos memory tweaks; Max/Min file cache etc, etc, etc - strangely if i increase Max or MinFileCache to 25% of ram my available RAM drops according to 'Rampage' ??. I currently run both at 8192 which reports 442 RAM on 'Rampage', anything higher drops to 332 ??? Any suggestions here ??

There is a memory twaeak for 512MB and above but i cant remember it at this precise moment - i'll try that.

Unfortunately I only have 2 slots of 168 dimm, my old 128's are in my spare PC so I might just fit one to try it out - trouble is the FE is so intermittent it might not do it for ages !!

Thanks again, much appreciated,

Mick

 

"Any suggestions here ?? "

Yes, dump Rampage at your earliest convenience and have a look at a sobering view on Memory Management.

The best manager was built into Win98 and was streets ahead of Win95. Win98SE went a step further.

Believe it or not a simple one liner such as:
mystring=string(200*512*1024, "* ") and saved as mem.vbs will force Windows to come up with 200Mb. I've been down to 2 to 3 Mb of unused physical ram and a pile of Vcache and Windows has found the necessary without calling upon the swap file. A completely pointless exercise - Windows would have done it anyway for any app requesting the same - rendering a memory manager as definitely surplus to requirements.

Normally, I'd let the system set the MinFileCache - it tends to allocate about 5Mb per 128Mb of Ram so in your case that will be about 20Mb. There may be an argument for games to set that yourself; as you have being doing. With regard MaxFileCache I'd let the system handle that unless you're in the 512Mb area [covered in the above link] and/or when a Ram Disk is employed as the Vcache manager will regard it as open season for its own use.

For Win98 we should forget 'free Ram' and think 'free Ram plus Vcache' as a general rule - 98 will even run code in the cache without duplicating it.

Memory managers are a false economy with Win98, generally have a large footprint, gobble up resources and impede on the CPU. I'd allow spyware on board before a memory manager!

BTW, with your increase in Ram you may like to set ConservativeSwapfileUsage=1, if you haven't already done so, in the 386Enh section of System.ini if there is any swap file activity as this will remove the uncertainty of when the page file async manager cuts in disturbing the flow of some games.

 

Mick

I don't call at this forum that often but I was just having a wander around and just realised that you started the Missing Memory thread. The last three posts were by WhitPhil and myself.

There I am on my soap box re Rampage and the like and WhitPhil had already displayed a thumbs down on third party memory managers and I mentioned the misunderstanding of ConservativeSwapfileUsage and the indiscriminate dumping of dynamic linked libraries; the latter two having a bearing on gaming.

 

Gamma thanks - I will dump 'Rampage' and follow your advice! I already have Conservativeswapfile=1 and have now added MaxPhysPage=20000 to system.ini 386enh hoping this may stop my boot-up problem.

Mike - I completed your detailed instructions (except; tempor(?)1 as I couldnt recall how to type the 'snake' symbol in DOS) - lets hope it works ???

Thanks again guys,

Mick

 

Snake, worm, squiggly line, Lol!

Tilde ~

1st key before the one on the number row accross the top. Hold down the shift.

If all the rest was done then that is OK!

Mike

 

Mick

I think we are simply rolling dice by implementing MaxPhysPage so the problem's frequency will probably just diminish.

Only time will time - finger's crossed.

 

Guys,

Sorry about the long wait to reply - I've been running my PC for a while to see if the problem occured again.

Unfortunately it did - FE on boot-up last week (same one), not had a problem since mind you (fingers crossed). I suspect its something I may have to live with if I want 512mb for gaming.

Rampage gone !!

Just keep nagging the missus for a new PC !

Mick