Resolved Mouse Not Functioning In Setup

I have a very frustrating problem here with a Windows repair.
The story so far ( I will try and keep it short) is after adding more ram to a Medion (not mine, a family members) PC running Windows XP Home it developed BSOD's. I attempted a System restore in Safe mode as safe mode was running ok but when the system restarted into windows it BSOD'd again.
My next step was a XP repair from the second R and all went well about three quarters through then the Mouse USB, yes I know, would freeze up and two to three minutes later BSOD.
In short the install will not go past one particular spot without the Mouse freezing.
My next step was, I disconnected the HDD and connected one of my spare drives changed the Mouse, I should mention at this point that this PC has NO PS2 connectors it is USB or Cordless. I connected a old Serial Mouse to the Comm port and disabled USB Mouse in the BIOS and installed a fresh copy of Windows XP Home Original delivered with the PC ) onto this HDD and tested it for several hours and no BSOD mouse working fine no problems at all. I then reconnect the original HDD again and run a repair install again but the serial mouse will not work with the original HDD, Why?? Why ???.
The upgrade of the Ram from 500MB to 2GB is causing no problems, stable on test over 4 hr. on the new install on my test HDD.
hawk22

To add to the confusion when I ran SeaTools DOS to test the drive the Mouse is working fine.

 

Hi hawk,

You should run CHKDSK /r on the drive. You can run it from the Recovery Console (the first R). I expect you have seen my advice not to stop CHKDSK, try setting it up to run overnight.

The areas that I think could be involved would be the file system or damage on the disk surface. A registry error (but it sounds like a stage before the registry is loaded). Maybe a driver problem. (Have you removed any PCI cards?)

Go into the BIOS and set it for "defaults ". (It might have one "Setup Defaults ", use that. It might be a function key like F9.)

Consider that the system is crashing, it is not just the mouse not working. (When it crashes, the mouse stops functioning first, it might just "freeze" from there or give a blue screen or restart.)

Matt

 

Hi Matt, thanks for the reply I appreciate that, man I really need some help on that one.
I have made progress since that post though, I did run SeaTools over night the long diagnostic and it finished the test with no Faults or Errors. I had the PC running now over more than 12 hr.on and off with the full ram update 2GIG installed XP Home onto one of my spare hard drives and the mashine is running great using the serial mouse. I did set the BIOS to Failsafe Defaults.
Yes I did one thing though before I installed the additional Ram, I did install a PCI NIC card as they had been having terrible slow internet speed with IPrimus ADSL the average download speed is between 7 and 12 kb/s no joke.
I thought I might try a NIC card but no diff so I had taken it out again.
I did try the windows repair again using the serial mouse that is working great in the other hard drive, but again no mouse, figure that one out, same CD to install fresh copy of XP Home works great with serial mouse, do the repair the mouse will not work.
Any help I will greatly appreciate.
hawk22

 

Passing the SeaTools test is good, but it could be a file system problem. You should run CHKDSK.

After that, I would suspect a driver.

Look up the BSOD error code at the MS knowledgebase.

Something might have modified the mouse driver. During the repair it will swap from standard drivers to those loaded on the Windows system, that's where it sounds where it might be crashing. See if it can now boot into Safe Mode.

Matt

 

Hi Matt, thanks again, unfortunately Windows will not let me boot into Safe Mode at this stage, because the repair has not finished installing Windows.
But I think that you are spot on when you say that during the repair the drivers will change. I have done much Googling and have discovered that I am not the only one with this problem, it is quite common to loose USB devices during a repair install, but so far all the remedies that I have found are not working for me. It always happens when the progress bar "Installing Devices" on the left side comes up this is the point when Mouse and Keyboard cut out.
The machine is otherwise stable I can let it run for hours as long as I don't try and do the repair install. (naturally no windows)
One advise that I googled was to integrate the USB Mouse and Keyboard drivers into the XP install CD by slipstreaming it.
I have looked but can not find any USB drivers for that to be able to slipstream them, but that could solve the issue from what you say by changing the drivers.
Very frustrating.
hawk22

 

Try less memory if you can (but it sounds like it is stable, although that is when then the problem started, isn't it?).

You mention the keyboard now, but I somehow think it is some higher level drivers. I suppose it could happen if keyboard or mouse drivers were updated with those from a model that requires specialised drivers. Some of driver files I see on my XP system are:
msmouse.inf (+ msmouse.PNF)
mouse.drv
keyboard.inf (+ keyboard.PNF)
keyboard.drv
keyboard.sys
You might want to try replacing those files with the same ones from the working HDD.

Something I haven't tried, but you might want to try replacing the folder C:\Windows\inf with the same folder from the working HDD. Whether it will work... [Edit: back up any files or folders you replace so that you can get them back if it fails, also, restart the Windows repair installation again by choosing "Press any key to boot to CD..." at startup.]

Is it time to back up their data and blow the old system away? I think it would be mine. Usually if there is problems during installation, but you get it going, it turns out to be "sick" and doesn't work very well (you might see it back again quite quickly ). If I have problems during installation, I don't hesitate long before blowing it away and starting afresh. If you come to that conclusion, not only reformat, but delete the Windows partition and make it again.

You want it to go back in time, but it seems it was unstable at that time.

Mmmm...have you checked how much free space is on the Windows drive? Windows needs around 15% to work and I would say 20% to work properly.

Matt

 

Hi Matt, Yes I have decided to start backing up all that I can back up from the drive, once I have done that than I will have to make some decisions on which way to go.
I did make a experiment with the new (well not new just my spare HD) I performed a system repair on it just like with the original and it went through the repair without any problems, so as you mention driver problem could be the cause.
What is your opinion of a idea that I have been having, connecting the non performing HD into one of my other machines that has PS2 connections and do a repair on it on that machine and then re-connect it again to the Medion with USB only and perform another repair to suit that motherboard again.Or
if it would work, I don't know I would like to make a clean install onto the second partition the original drive has 3 partitions (the last one a recovery)
the second partition has something like 100GIG free space with not much data on it that I could back up, and install a clean windows into that partition and thereafter combine the old C with the new C and create one bigger C partition, that way I thought I would not loose any data and still have a new clean install.
I have no concerns anymore that the machine is not stable as I had run the Seatools for several hours and left it on all night without blue screen or crashing it will only freeze the mouse and keyboard yes at first I thought it was only the mouse but it is actually both as the light on the remote keyboard transmitter stops lighting up when hitting keys.
And as I mentioned I performed a repair install on the new hard drive without incident.
Sorry Matt to kind of loading that onto you.
hawk22

 

During the repair Windows picks the drivers it thinks the hardware should use from the original list of drivers. If you try repairing it on another computer, then change back again, the original drivers will still be in the list and Windows will just try to install them again. That's why I suggested changing the Windows\inf folder for the one that works (on your spare drive). That folder will be where Windows selects the drivers it thinks matches the hardware.

Does the install ask for Activation? If it does, when you change to the other computer, the 4 pieces of hardware that it uses to monitor Activation will be changed and you will get locked out.

The second method sounds "messy ". At the least, if you go changing drive letters the boot files will stop working.

There is a "parallel install" How to install or upgrade to Windows XP Method 4. It would be a lot less messy, it should save the User Profiles, BUT most of the programs that were installed on the original will be orphaned and their folders in the Program Files folder will be useless unless you reinstall the same program.

Matt

 

Hi Matt, thanks for the reply, and sorry about my slow reply, I have been saving all the data that I had to save from the crippled HDD I have it hooked up to my portable USB dock.
I am also creating a Slipstreamed XP Home CD with SP3, the machine had SP2 installed but the original Install CD is only SP1a.
I had made a call to Medion regarding a driver CD and they told me that on the second partition is a Driver Folder I did back that up as well and while I was looking at the included drivers I noticed that there are remote optical mouse and keyboard drivers, so I thought I might include them in the slipstreamed CD.
Don't know if it will make any difference or not but thought what the heck why not.
I have been in constant contact with Rockster2U and he feels strongly about Virus, Malware, or even Keyloggers being present on the drive, so I am looking into that as well.
When I was disconnecting the hard drive to connect to my USB dock I discovered a very strange (to me anyway) setup, the hard drive was connected to the secondary connector and the optical drive was primary, now this computer was in original condition the cable was very professionally arranged and I know no one had opened this box before.
This in my opinion would have been slowing down the PC considerably, would this also come into the equation with the present problems.
cheers
hawk22

 

When you ran the SeaTools, did you notice the designation for the drive, HDD0, HDD1, HDD2, etc? That will tell you it's setup on the IDE controllers. It will also be on the list of current Windows installations, when you start the Windows setup from CD. If it is set as HDD0, then it is the master on the primary controller, if it is HDD2, it is master on the secondary controller. If it is HDD2 and the BIOS is set to boot to HDD2, I suppose that would work, but under normal circumstances the boot drive should be HDD0.

Some motherboards had the primary IDE controller rated as ATA100 or ATA120 and the secondary as ATA60. You needed to connect HDDs to the primary controller with an 80 lead cable, optical drives were connected to the secondary controller and only needed a 40 lead cable. If a HDD was connected to the secondary controller, it would only run at ATA60. You would need to look at the motherboard specifications to see if both controllers are rated at ATA100 (or 120).

How are you going to "include the drivers in the slipstreamed CD "? Can the slipstream process put the driver files into the correct folders? [I expect they need to be included in the i386 folder on the CD.]

It seems like you are using a wireless mouse and keyboard (and wanted to try repairing Windows on a computer with PS/2 connectors and tried the serial mouse). Have you tried or can you try using an ordinary wired USB mouse and keyboard?

Matt

 

I felt it would be best for me to openly address Hawk's problem and provide an explanation so any readers would better understand why I haven't posted to this thread earlier. My schedule right now is such that I can not follow a bunch of threads on a daily basis and I expect it to stay that way for the next couple of months. Simply put, I am building a garage/workshop and we are remodeling our house. I felt it was inappropriate for me to jump into any thread if I couldn't guarantee regular followup on a daily basis. So, while I have continued to follow a few threads of particular interest, I have been pretty quiet on the BBS. I'm not going anywhere, I've just been temporarily "diverted ".

Hawk emailed me and I have answered his emails but perhaps this should have been done on the board for the benefit of others. With this in mind, I am going to add a couple of selected comments previously emailed to Hawk.

Following Matt's initial comments, I said

I could add additional information but I think the above still remains a pretty accurate summary of my opinion. Matt has been pretty close to right on the money and if I felt otherwise, I would have contacted Matt to discuss it. There has never been a mention of a keylogger and although this certainly appears to be a driver related issue, I'm not yet ready to give that Seagate drive a clean bill of health either.

Stick with it Hawk - you'll get this one licked one way or another.

 

Yes Yes Yes, Success at last, it is 1AM and I am going to bed.
hawk22

 

So, while you sleep, the world remains in suspense .......

Congratulations but please let us know what it was and how you fixed it. Nice job.

 

Hey Rockster, good to see you Thanks for the info about the rootkits, next time I come across a difficult reinstall I will give that some thought. Doesn't seem easy to overcome though. I expect I have come across some already, but haven't recognised them (they would have gotten "blown away ").

People seem to want to keep their original installation indefinitely nowadays. I have prided myself on how long I can keep an original installation and it has been a little hard work at times. Now, I don't mind so much about reformatting, it clears out the cobwebs. It allows fresh drivers to be installed and all the Windows Updates or Service Packs to be loaded fresh. I like to try and find a possible cause for the why a system has deteriorated though, before it gets backed up and vaporised

Matt

 

Hi and thanks Rockster and Matt,
It is great to have Guys like you here, I actually agree with you Matt regarding hanging on too long to installations, I was actually working on of my systems when this one came along. Although this would not be for everyone but I feel it suited me for what I wanted to do. I was upgrading my main machine and as usual I have tons of stuff on it, the HDD getting to small and I did not want to loose a lot of the old stuff that I could not replace, to cut a long story short I setup my spare machine with a new HDD in this case a WD 808.8 GIG on the Motherboard that I had intended for the upgrade installed a clean version of XP Pro SP3 onto it, bought the LapLink USB transfer cable from England for $Au 14.50 including postage plus the PC Mover $29.50 and selected all the programs and Folders that I wanted to transfer onto the new HDD and let it run. Result all my old stuff that I wanted to keep on the new HDD with a fresh version of XP, went like a dream.

Now to the subject of this headache, to be honest I don't know which action was responsible or if it was the combination of things.
I did a online scan with Eset AV only to minor Ask Toolbar spyware items to be found, I removed the internal Modem as there is no more need for it, and I was advised that any NIC items could cause problems, I also removed all other ram except one stick of 512MB, disabled anything that I could in the BIOS like onboard sound,onboard 1394, onboard LAN, enabled Reset Configuration Data.
Plus I made a new install CD with integrated SP3, also tried one with drivers, but could not do it, not enough space on the CD, and as the original MS is CD I would not try with DVD.
I have to confess that when at the 33 min mark of installing Devices the mouse and keyboard stopped functioning a few chosen words passed my lips that I can not repeat on here. but the system kept on running and the clock kept on winding down and once it rebooted into windows and mouse and keyboard returned the weight lifted off my shoulders.

Things that I will take note of from now will be: No Motherboards for me that have no PS2 connectors, and never attempt a "System Restore" or "System Repair" unless the system is 100% stable.
Thanks again to you guys.
hawk22

 

Seems like you have donged it hawk. Looks like a conflict, resources or a clash of drivers or... a clash of software that runs the drivers (but I don't think software would be loaded at that stage).

You will need to re-enable those things you have disabled and get all the RAM reinstalled. If you put them all back at once, it might decide to start being unstable again (I thought of another description, ****- itself).

You probably need to isolate the cause.

Well done getting it going.

Matt

 

Hi and thanks Matt, yes I have re-installed all the ram and reset the BIOS and it never looked back once, all went smooth as silk, (for a change).
The machine is now back with its owner and is running very well, I had it running testing for around 20 hours never stopped once.
My feeling is that disabling items in the BIOS and creating a SP3 Install CD could have been the main change that seen it through.
Using the serial mouse did not help, and as I mentioned both Mouse and Keyboard stopped working after the 33min mark, by the way I could not lay a hand on a direct USB Keyboard I used the wireless one but a direct USB Mouse.

Thanks again for your support Matt
hawk22

 

Wow, curiouser and curiouser.

Mr Hawk, please don't forget to mark your thread Resolved