Networking Win2k:Win98 Password Error

Ok,
I am trying to network a win2k comp with win98 comp. I have done this before and it works fine. It is working now with one exception..

Win2k can access win98, but when win98 tries to access Win2k it does this:

You Must Supply A Password To Make This Connection:

Resource: \\MYSTIC\IPC$
Password:___________


When i chose to share my drives i didnt choose a password! Any help would be much appreciated.
Thx all

 

You must login to the win98 machine with a valid username that the win2k machine will recognise

 

The IPC is just trying to verify that you are a correct user

Log into Windows 98 (dont just cancel) with a username and password that is defined on the 2k box

 

File System

This problem is most likely caused because you have an NTFS file system in win2k. Win98 is fat 32 and cannot read NTFS.

 

The type of file system makes no difference

98 is connecting to the NTFS (if thats what it is), not trying to mount the disk itself

If you couldnt connect 9x clients to NTFS disks then NT 4 would have been an even bigger fiasco than it was !

 

?

On my home network which has Windows 98se, two XP Professional, one Win2k server and one win2k pro - Win98 cannot access NTFS partitions and I get the same msg as you. All ntfs partitions can be read by the NTFS pcs and all fat 32 can be read by all pcs.
Windows 98 can, however access any other fat32 partitions.
I have read on this forum a few times that fat32 win98 will not read ntfs
Maybe I have been misinformed.

 

I have a small network in my house. Win98, now ME connected to Win2k(NTFS) machine. 98,ME has no problem reading the shared folders on the 2k machine as long as I use a valid username that win2k recognises.

98, ME will not be able to read an NTFS drive if you physically put that drive into that computer and try to mount it.

 

silvercue - the answer is yes & no.

No, Win98 cannot read NTFS partitions so if you have a drive on a 98 dual-boot system that is using NTFS, a Win98 startup & logon will not be able to see the stuff.

Yes, any Win PC can see network shares on other Win PCs regardless of what OS/File system they are running because it will not be trying to read the drive/partition directly.

MysTiC - Your problem is because 9x/ME handles security very differently than NT and if you are using workgroups, 9x can have problems since the NT security is very user oriented and the user hasn't been properly identified. Easiest is probably to put a user account on the 2K box that exactly matches the logon/password for 98 and then make sure you logon to the 98 machine.

 

Thanks for the summation Newt

I think you've said very clearly what I was (clumsily) trying to say in my two previous posts

 

I have the same question as the original poster, i.e.

"I am trying to network a win2k comp with win98 comp.... I have done this before and it works fine. It is working now with one exception...Win2k can access win98, but when win98 tries to access Win2k it does this:

You Must Supply A Password To Make This Connection:

Resource: \\< "computer name ">\IPC$
Password:___________ "

================================

holyhandgrenade states: "You must login to the win98 machine with a valid username that the win2k machine will recognise "

Perhaps you might elucidate how this is to be accomplished. I have set up a "user profile and password" on the W98 machine, and the identical user/password on the W2000 machine, and logged on with that user-id (on the W98 machine, and even on both machines) with absolutely no difference.

=======================
AndyO informs us "The IPC is just trying to verify that you are a correct user. Log into Windows 98 (dont just cancel) with a username and password that is defined on the 2k box "

Perhaps you might translate that for us? IPC? Log into W98 (dont [sic] just cancel)? How do you propose that one Log on mid error message, when entering the correct password or cancellation are the only two available options? And, as previously stated, it makes no difference if the identical username/password combination is defined on the "2k box" (by which I assume you mean the computer on which the Windoze 2000 "operating system" is installed?).

[BTW, Kamikaze pilots wore helmets because they were members of the Japanese air force, and helmets were a required part of the uniform. If you find it ironic that a suicide bomber wears protection, consider the negligent amount of protection afforded by a leather helmet in -any- combat situation. So the question is no more amusing than "why did Kamikaze pilots wear clothing ".]

============================================

silvercue suggests "This problem is most likely caused because you have an NTFS file system in win2k. Win98 is fat 32 and cannot read NTFS. "

An interesting theory, but certainly not applicable in my case, and hardly to be the "most likely cause ". In fact, were this to be the problem, a totally different error message would result.

==============================================

Newt adds to the confusion with "the answer is yes & no....Your problem is because 9x/ME handles security very differently than NT and if you are using workgroups, 9x can have problems since the NT security is very user oriented and the user hasn't been properly identified. Easiest is probably to put a user account on the 2K box that exactly matches the logon/password for 98 and then make sure you logon to the 98 machine. "

All this is very logical, and probably correct. But let's have a bit more detail, so we can actually get the two talking to one another.

"if you are using workgroups, 9x can have problems since the NT security is very user oriented and the user hasn't been properly identified. "

Ok, but how does one NOT use workgroups, as it is a required part of the information? I've discovered the hard way that W2000 will NOT allow any imbedded blanks in the "computer name ", whereas W98 will. If there are imbedded blanks, this will prevent the two talking to one another. W2000 requires the "workgroup" to be all uppercase, but displays it in "capitalized" lower case format. W98 will allow it to be upper, lower, or mixed case. This may cause the two to be unable to communicate as well.

"Easiest is probably to put a user account on the 2K box that exactly matches the logon/password for 98 and then make sure you logon to the 98 machine. "

Done. Didn't change one thing! Creating identical username/password accounts on both machines, and logging into those accounts makes absolutely no difference in the problem described at the beginning of the thread.

Ironically, ICS works even though the W98 machine is unable to access W2000 files!

====================

Anyway, the interim solution is to uninstall W2000 (or dual-boot back to W98) and use W98 as the server/host/gateway computer. Despite the common wisdom that W2000 is a more stable system, with better networking computers, it took 1 hour to install an operational W98 network with ICS. I'm now in my 3rd week of trying to do the same with W2000. :-(

 

cdgoldin - if your PC belongs to a domain, workgroups aren't needed. Also, all the user rights issues are dealt with by various domain-provided services so no need to have a user account on any additional PCs. But I sorta assumed the original poster was not running a domain controller and would be using workgroups.

The advice would be totally different for the two configurations.

NT systems are totally "user oriented" when it comes to sharing and security.

On the 2K PC,
- if you have a user account /w pwd that is identical to the logon being used on the 9x system,
- and if you have the user in a group with appropriate rights (user, administrator, whatever),
- and if you are logging on to the 9x pc,
- and if the 9x PC has clients for microsoft networks properly installed and running,
- and if the user account or a group it has membership in is included in the permissions section for the share

then the 98 PC should be able to see and work with a share on the 2K PC.

=============================================

And while I dislike ICS (a horrible kludge that does manage to work but is way more confusing than it should be), I can get it working on a setup like you describe. However, the original post asked about other issues and those were what several of us spoke to.

If you are running broadband, spend $100 (or less) on a router/switch that will do NAT and forget the ICS bit. If you are running dial-up, try broadband and I think you will like it.

=============================================

I am sitting here trying to convince myself not to flare up at sarcasm from someone who by the experience he lists must have been in college in the early 60s and certainly should know better than to post a bit of sarcasm aimed at folks who have spent time on here trying to help others. So far it is working - but barely - so I'm gonna post this while I am still civil.

 

MysTiC -

simply means the 2K system didn't recognize the user account trying to gain access.

 

newt....

you wrote,

"I am sitting here trying to convince myself not to flare up at sarcasm from someone who by the experience he lists must have been in college in the early 60s and certainly should know better than to post a bit of sarcasm aimed at folks who have spent time on here trying to help others. So far it is working - but barely - so I'm gonna post this while I am still civil. "

let me be the first to say that i applaud your restraint. you took the right road, not the easy one.

thanks for all you do here.



mark

 

I have the same situation here. One win2k Pro machine and one Win98 SE.

I have found that you do need the exact name(&password) on the Win2k machine as you are using on the Win98 machine.

But also I found you have to watch how you name the shares on the Win2k machine. A long name is not recognized on the Win98 machine.

I also have to make sure I am using the Netbieu protocol on both machines.

 

Like Newt I am showing restraint.....

Not changing my signature though

 

OK Mystic! And others about the IPC$ and connecting to Win2K


Comments

First: I hope you are not set up as a Domain for 2 computers or a small private network!! Geez! But this dosen't matter for connections in this case!

Second: You really should have no reason to have NTFS on a home system or most small private networks. But most of them come that way if you buy a completly set up computer! Again this dosen't matter here!

Why not NTFS? Come "fix it" time it sure is nice to boot from a DOS boot disk and retrive valuable documents and files before having to format and start over! And also if you know what you are doing mabe even fix the problem and get 2K back up!

But if you do have NTFS it has nothing to do with logon to another station in either direction. No matter what the work station is, MAC, Unix even DOS, if it is connected and proper logon is used, and permissions are correct it will see the NTFS partition of the Win2k\WinXp computer!

What is meant by the phrase "Win98,95, ME cannot read NTFS partitions" applies only if these partitions are on the local machine that is running 98 95 or ME.

How do you get that? Several ways! But! Suppose you had a Win2k machine that had 2 partitions say both or the 2nd partition was NTFS. So you format the 1st partition and install 98,95 or Me on the 1st partition but leave the NTFS on the 2nd partition! The NTFS partition is still there but it is totally invisable to 98,95,ME!

Third: Someone said "Win98 and Win2K handle security differently" no offence intended BUT!

Win98 has no security!! None! Just because you have a user name with a password does not mean security. On Win98 it only allows windows to know who is logged on, User Profiles or not.

That said let's do the steps to connect these computers:

1. On the Win2K (yes it does have security (some any way ). Go to Control Panel choose users and passwords create a new user and password. Example Tom, password of say opensesame!

Be sure you know the Administrator password especially if you are using auto logon "if your machine does not requie you to enter a password when it boots then you are using auto logon ".

Now log off the machine and log back onto the same computer using the new user and password! If it lets you on then you have succesfully created a ligitimate user. Don't forget to log back off and back on as you originally were!

2. Now for the win98 station! Go to network neighborhood and change the workgroup to match the workgroup on the Win2k machine! You do know, or know how to find the workgroup of the Win2K station, Right! While you are here make sure that Client for Microsoft networks is installed! In any case this win98 computer "must" require you to logon with a username and password!

Now reboot and enter the username and password that you created on the Win2k machine!

Now you should see the Win2K machine. Of course you have a shared drive, folder or a printer on the 2k machine that you want to use!

OK Childern! Now Have fun!

 

mflynn - welcome to the bbs.

Nice step-by-step HOW TO for the connection issues.

A couple of your points before you got into the specifics I'd quibble with a bit (3 to be precise) but nice post.

And really nice to have a fellow North Carolinian around. Especially one who can include an old fud like me amongst the "children ".

 

Hi Newt

Thanks for the welcome! I was more reading the messages than the names and I didn't realize you were so close! At frist I didn't understand what you meant about item 3.

But after rereading all the messages I see that you were the one that mentioned win98 security. I could have said the same myself to simplify the answer to someone that didn’t understand the concept. But they got your point and that is, there is a big difference in the two, in the way they handle logging on. I really shouldn’t have mentioned it and as I said no offence meant all! So please don’t be offended in the least!

Win98 "Security" is one of my tender points! I’ve had people ask me how to put in a Username and password so many times! I used to answer "whyâ€? Do you like to type? They say no I have some confidential stuff and need the security. I used to say win98 has no security. They say well what good is a password etc and on and on. So I quit explaining and just do it, then as I am actually standing in the door to leave or the last thing before I hang up the phone I say "now remember win98 has no security it’s only used to identify you to windows" then I’m gone! I don’t want to discuss it with them but I don’t want them coming back later and blaming me if something does happen!

Also I had a client call me once after I had been there removed a logon for a user station on a 3 node win98 p2p network. I did this at the request of the user! Well it seems they also have a local guy that does a few things for them when I can’t come! When he saw no logon he told the management that I had killed all security and opened up the system to anyone! Here I go explaining again! I made them understand finally!

I looked at you stats, WOW! Over 1300 posts!!!! Don’t ever feel you need to do volunteer work because you already are, I think you have paid you dues!

I too am a Systems Administrator. Been involved with computers now for 24 years! Used to program in Assembly language like writing longhand did C Pascal etc. but for the last 14 years or so it’s been all hardware and operating systems and networks. I have 60 clients in 6 states that I have installed their networks (size from 2 stations up to 70-80 stations) some of the small ones are win98 p2p. Most from 10 up are 2000 Server! We use a combo of PcAnywhere, Terminal services and VPN for remote support! And of course when bad things happen on site visits, which I hate to travel anymore!!!!

Anyway let us hope Mystic gets his NW going because he has plenty of help!

See ya later Gator!
What!!!!! Did I say Gator! I hate that little green tu_d!

Mike Flynn

 

Mike - I am doing almost all network admin myself these days. 2nd shift and mostly waiting around for something to fall and go boom. Since the possible $$ loss is high for down systems, they are quite willing to pay me to sit most of the time.

So, in an 8 hour shift, I spend around 6 hours either here or on a couple of fishing boards. This one helps keep my hand in. Research to figure out things I have gotten hazy on.

Agreed, 9X security is not good. Never meant to be and users have simply dragged the OS into situations where it never belonged.

NTFS - easiest way I know of to get small clusters on a large drive. FAT makes you partition way too much to suit me. Also for me at least has been more robust and fault tolerant.

Domains with only a few computers - agreed, not essential and probably not as easy as workgroups. Good, however, if you are trying to get some hands-on with a business style network.

As to offended - that only happens when someone is snide/sarcastic when they posted here asking for help. Rare. Maybe one a month or something.

And if you are using PCAW over slow connections, you might want to consider NetOp. Seriously better at doing what PCAW does and lots faster.

 

Hi Newt

Man that sounds like Shangri-La to me I could stand it for a while! It’s so busy at my office that I typically miss lunch at least 2 days a week. Sometimes it seems like it should be 5:00 but is only 2:00 other times at 5:00 I actually think it is 2 or 3:00. Most of my days are doing remote support online or phone or both! My best days are when I can go to the restroom at my leasure and get to go to lunch with the guys.

The reason I have had time to respond to the BBS is that I have been home resting from a trip that began last Wed, I worked thru the weekend til 9:30 "“ 10:00 ea night usually started at 7:00 am. I arrived home Monday night at 10:00. Sleeping late nap in the afternoon, out to eat with my daughter etc.

I was so exhausted I could hardly stand. So I’ve been resting up and finally today after 3 days I am back to normal! I am going back tommorow.

This trip is not usual, I went to clean up a botched up (by a contractor) 2K Server installation several new workstations and 2 remote sites one with multiple computers. Just tons of details! Plus I hate to travel anymore! Thank goodness my travel is sporatic sometimes I can go for months without travel then all the time for a while!

Thanks about suggesting the NetOp but most of my PCAW is at DSL/Cable/T1. I am trying to do away with PCAW anyway. One product that Microsoft did a good job on is terminal services. I am totally impressed with the speed even at 33.6!

I agree with you about NTFS in addition to the additional security it is a must in a business! But I will not put everything into it. I always only use NTFS on drives that contain critical data! But I want to access my OS partition from dos if needed! But anyone setting up a 2 node network at home say to share a few files or internet connection has no business with NTFS or Domains unless they know how to handle them because sooner or later it will get them in trouble. Now if the reason is to learn about them, then of course! To save a few clusters, nah I’m not going to have a HD that don’t have 10’s of gigs free any way!

Enough!
Later, Mike