Upgaded from 98 and Failed

Now I'm in trouble!

I bought a Windows 2000 c/d on E-bay.

when loading as an upgrade the process got to a certain stage and then my screen went blue with a fatal exception and the p/c shut down.

What I did next was my downfall.

I started msconfig and did a selective start up. 2000 appeared to load up O.K.

Unfortunately it loaded as a second O.S. And I now have to choose which system I want at start up?

I have tried to get on with it by loading some programmes onto the 2000 system but the files I have already in 98 can't be found when using 2000.

I would like to remove windows 2000 and have another go at Upgrading windows 98. which is still working at the moment.
How do I do that?
Any help will be appreciated.
Ta.
Quiz.

 

Could it be that easy?

A further question, having just looked in windows explorer on the windows 98 OS
I noticed a folder called WINNT
I don't know if it was there before?
But if I delete it, will that get rid of windows 2000 and allow me to start again with the install?

 

Yes they both work, but the new 2000 system needs a lot of programmes added to it and if I do that, then I will be taking up a lot of the hard drive by duplicating everything.

 

You have done what is called a parallel install, that is both OSes on the same partition. It is possible to remove the 2K install by simply deleting all the files from the root of the partition and then fixing the boot sector, but you need to know what files to delete. The WINNT folder is as you correctly guessed the main thing to delete, but there will be several other files/folders mixed in with the 98 ones. It wouldn’t do any harm if you left a few behind, but you don’t want to delete a Win98 file.

Of course you do realise that some of your programs in 98 may not run in 2k after the upgrade.You could also have driver issues and so have to source and install 2K specific drives for some of your hardware.

Now that you’ve done it I would say to keep the dual boot for a time until you are sure that 2K is going to run without problems on your machine. Check that all’s working and install your most required programs to see if they work in 2K. You will still be able to use 98 while you are doing this. If you setup 2K fully then you can delete 98 when you no longer need it. You would end up with a cleaner install of 2K.

 

I was thinking that if I could just get rid of the 2k system now I could persevere with re-loading it as an upgrade.
That way all the personal stuff built up over time in 98 would still be available .
I know that I should just back stuff up to c/d and then load over the top of the 2k system but I will lose things like address books and Outlook files/mail.
That is if I can get Outlook 2000 to work with the 2k system.
Also, if I continue with the parrallel systems, will it not be just as difficult to remove the 98 OS later on and a risk to the then stabilised 2k system?

Quiz

 

No harder removing 98 later on as 2K now, and I don’t think it would put the new 2K at risk. However if you want to go ahead with the upgrade then I would advise that you backup all personal data before hand. I read what you just said to mean you don’t have current backups of your email, address book… whatever.

You would be taking a risk with your data carrying out an upgrade. Ok it is supposed to retain it, but things go wrong, and often, and that is why this forum exists. Before you go ahead at least boot into 2K and look in Device Manager and see if any of your hardware does not have drivers installed. You should source suitable drivers before you do the upgrade.

 

To remove 2K you will need a Win98 startup floppy. Boot with it to the A:\> prompt and then type sys c: and press Enter. Wait till you get the message System Transferred, then reboot the computer. This will have made 98 independent again, removed the boot manager and fixed the bootsector.

Once in 98 show all hidden and system files, and show file extensions. Double click on the C: drive icon and this will show you all the files and folders in the root of the drive, (you will see the WINNT folder there).

Delete these folders:
WINNT
Documents and Settings

And these files:
Bootsect.dos
Ntdetect.com
ntldr
boot.ini
pagefile.sys

Because you are about to upgrade to 2K on the same partition I don’t think we need to delete any more. Everything is about to be replaced anyway. However could you just list for me all the folders that are still there.

 

Maybe I'm missing something here but I don't see any reason for copying system files to the hard drive nor do I see any reason for re-writing the boot sector. You guys can correct me if I'm wrong but why not just delete or rename the winnt folder (while running in win98), boot from the win2k cd and install over the top of 98? Yeah, you'll still have the dual boot option in the boot menu but that can be fixed easy enough by editing the boot.ini once everything's up and running. What am I missing here?

 

Hi Zander, what you suggest would probably work but I’ve never tried having a parallel install of 2K inside 2K, so there may be variables I would not be aware of. I could not suggest to anyone to try something I had never done myself. Beside I do think it would be better to remove the parallel install when it is easier to identify which files are which, there’s no mistaking the difference 98 and 2K files. With two installs of 2K, if there were duplicate files it would be harder to know which OS they belonged to. There would probably be a shared Documents and Setting folder that you could not delete and so would always have references in it to the removed 2K.

Quiz, to do an upgrade you have to run the CD from inside Windows, not boot the computer from it. During setup you will get the option to connect to Microsoft and possibly download new hardware drivers, but I’ve never used this option myself and don’t know how reliable it is.

Normally after the upgrade the first thing to do will be to install the chipset drivers, then the graphics card drivers, then all the others like modem, sound card, ethernet etc. Depending on your hardware some might not be needed, but I would always recommend installing the latest chipset drivers from your motherboards manufacturer

I think you are expecting the upgrade to do everything for and on reboot to find it all ready to use. Perhaps with XP that might be the case, but not with 2K. I recommend again that you use the current dual boot to find and test the drivers you will need. 2K can be a funny beast and you may even need a bios update to make everything compatible. You may be lucky, but it’s not worth taking the chance if the computer is required in a working condition and especially if you have unsaved data on there.

Take your time and have a read round this site first. http://www.dewassoc.com/support/win2000/installwin2000.htm

 

Thanks Guys, not sure what to do for the best now, Zander you make it sound very easy, as it probably is? McTavish, you make it sound very difficult and so recommend caution.
Windows 98 is working at the moment as is a limited windows 2000 professional, but I have managed an internet connection with the 2000 its a shame that the 98 internet favourites cannot just swap over to 2000, as with all the other personal files?
Never mind, a decision will be madew soon.
Quiz.

 

Well, to be honest, I've done this type of thing with XP and Win9X but haven't ever tried it with 2k. That's why I asked if I'm missing something here. If it were me, I'd do as McTavish says and make sure I had drivers for all of the hardware and then make sure it all works properly. The fact that you got a blue screen while installing it makes me wonder if there might be a hardware conflict somewhere. That's why you should probably run it for a bit to see if any problems show up.

Once I was sure it was going to all work I'd do as I described. This is a assuming I wanted to keep all of my programs installed on 98 in tact. I'm not saying that you should do this, only that it's what I'd do. Depends on how brave you are. I'm one of those types that's willing to try anything once. My best guess is that it will work but I can't say for sure. If you try it, be sure to back up anything you don't want to lose, just in case. If you don't have any way of backing things up I'd definitly think twice about it. If you wait a bit, maybe somebody who's tried this (or at least knows something more about it) will have something to say about all of this.

FWIW, I'd prefer the clean install route (format and all) and always recommend this myself but if you want to keep everything in tact in the old windows installation the only way to do it is to upgrade. If you try this, during the installtion when it asks where you want it be installed be sure to pick the old windows folder and be sure it doesn't create a winnt subfolder in there. The path should be c:\windows and nothing else. This is assuming that's where 98 is installed.

You should be able to do that easy enough. Just copy the favorites from the favorites folder in 98 to the favorites folder in 2k. As for personal files, pictures, mp3s, ms word files, etc., you should still have access to them. If you decided to delete the 98 folder and stick with 2k the way it is now, any personal files should still be there for you unless you happened to put them in a subfolder of the windows folder that you deleted. You should be able to access them using windows explorer.

 

I’ve found with 2k that many times it will go easy enough with only a few drivers to install, but I have had times where it’s taken days to sort out all the issues – where bios upgrades have been necessary, where graphics have been a nightmare to get working and even one case where the motherboard was just totally incompatible with 2K. I’m just trying to advise you to be prepared for problems so you don’t end up with a disaster.

It sounds like you are a good way there. Are your graphics ok? Have you looked in Device Manager to see if any drivers are still needed? You should not really start configuring the OS until this is sorted.

Did you take precautions from the Blaster worm before you connected 2k to the net? Even if your 2K disk includes SP4 you won’t be immune. It takes an average of 20 seconds on the net for an unpatched or non firewalled install of 2K/XP to become infected.

 

Hi Zander, I saw your last thread just a little too late and was in the process of following your earlier advice and deleting the WINNT folder and any thing else I could find on the 'c' drive that was created at the same time.
As for the boot.ini file, I found that too and changed it from

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=C:\
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)\WINNT= "Microsoft Windows 2000 Professional" /fastdetect
C:\= "Microsoft Windows "

to this

[boot loader]
timeout=30
default=C:\
[operating systems]
multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(1)
C:\= "Microsoft Windows "


but it is still not right as on boot, it is still looking for another OS.
do you know what it should say?

I never mentioned earlier my reason for the upgrade.
It was not that I was'nt happy with windows 98.
It was because I bought a new Nokia and the PCSUITE software that came with it would not 'speak' to any thing older than windows 2000
I sort of wish I'd sent the phone back instead.
Hopefully though I will get it sorted out
But the 2000 OS will not load as an upgrade all the time it thinks that there are 2 operating systems still on my p/c.
Hence the earlier question.
I do believe that the initial upgrade failure was due to Norton internet security 2004. although I had it 'disabled' I probably should have removed it and then re-loaded once 2000 was in place?
Quiz.

 

Ah, McTavish
you slipped that post in while I was writing mine (takes me ages)
No I did not take any precautions against the Blaster worm, and I was online 'unprotected' for about 30 minutes upgrading to SP3 or SP4 not sure which now. and can't find out cos I've deleted it.
will the blaster get into windows 98 or will it have been deleted with WINNT ?

I never got as far as looking at the device manager because when I tried to load 2000 last time the boot loader (netdetect I think) could not find it.
So I went to plan 2 and followed Zanders earlier advice instead.
Quiz.

 

Though this reply is not directly concerned with Quiz's immediate problem, but he has indeed raised a very important issue that things can and do go wrong while upgrading.

I personally don't prefer upgrade from Win9x to 2000/XP due to following reasons:
1. The past goes with you - all the muck and grime that you have accumulated during years of computer use is retained.
2. Converting to NTFS is a pain at worst and mediocre at best. Its best to start with an NTFS partition in the first place.
3. There are few problems to contend with while doing a new install - no drivers clashes or program freezes.

So I would prefer if Quiz could take a backup and reformat and resinstall 2000. Guaranteed to work.

 

I would think if you did get Blaster is should be gone with the WINNT folder, but make sure you also delete the 2K Documents and Settings folder and do a full AV scan in 98 before you go any further.

 

I do not know anything ( and I mean nothing ) about 2K. But when upgrading 95 to 98, 98 to 98SE or 98SE to XP, it is VERY IMPORTANT that the machine be booted from a power off state directly to the boot floppy. Then start the new install from the proper place.

If the machine is not cold booted directly to the floppy there will be things in memory ( files in use ) which will not get overwritten.

And also we need to watch CAREFULLY that the upgrade goes into the existing Windows folder. At least that applys to 95, 98 and XP. I do not know if 2K uses a C:\Windows folder or not.

BillyBob

 

So, where are at with this now? Can you still boot to both win2k and 98 or just one of them or none? Is this disk you bought an upgrade disk or regular full install version?