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New hard drive with Norton Ghost

Discussion in 'Other PC Software' started by JAK, 2003/11/12.

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  1. 2003/11/12
    JAK

    JAK Well-Known Member Thread Starter

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    Replacing an old 6.4 gig with a 13 gig. Have win98. With old hd imaged to cds can you just pull out the old hd and put in new formatted hd and reload image from cds? It's Ghost from Systemworks Pro 2003. Thanks a lot.
     
    JAK,
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  2. 2003/11/12
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff

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    Hi JAK!

    When You create an Image of a harddisk or partition, I don´t believe that everything gets copied and I´m not sure that the 13 gig would boot the system.

    The thing to do is to clone the 6.4 gig to the 13 gig but there are so many caveats that I suggest that You read RADIFIED Guide to Norton Ghost.

    You need to do a disk to disk clone and take a look on the comments about removing the cloned drive before rebooting from "Ghost-DOS ".

    I´m not sure about this but I would think that if You shut down and put the 13 gig on the second controller and start the computer with the Ghost Boot Disks, if the 13 gig is recognized, it is only to go ahead to clone from the 6.4 gig.

    When finished, exit from Ghost but do not restart, just kill the power.
    Remove the 6.4 gig and put the 13 gig on the primary controller.

    Cross Your fingers and restart the computer.

    Never done this but this is how I would try ...... ;) ......

    Christer
     

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  4. 2003/11/12
    reboot

    reboot Inactive

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    Don't get complicated Christer. :D
    The ghost image on the CD, is totally complete, right down to the bootstrap sectors and FAT tables.

    Start the computer with the Ghost diskette.
    Select Local, Disk, From Image.
    Select the source (the CD-ROM drive) and destination (your new 13 gig) and let it run.
    When complete, restart the computer, and voila.
    It's that simple.
     
    Last edited: 2003/11/12
  5. 2003/11/12
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff

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    Hi Reboot!

    Symantec Support actually told me that an Image is a file by file copy and not a sector by sector (or whatever) copy which makes it miss some of the information.

    If You have actually done it, then I see more reason to doubt SS rather than You simply because I know that they have been wrong before but I don´t know about You ...... :D ......

    I (hopefully) stand corrected!

    Christer
     
    Last edited: 2003/11/12
  6. 2003/11/12
    JAK

    JAK Well-Known Member Thread Starter

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    So Reboot, I make the Ghost copy of the old 6.4 hd. Then shut 'er down, and remove the old hd and put in the new 13 hd. Then boot up with the first cd of the Ghost image cds and away we go? Will there be any problem of the difference between the space of the 6.4 and the 13, or will that just be empty space like about 2 gigs of my 6.4 is currently? Thanks for your time all of you. JAK
     
    JAK,
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  7. 2003/11/17
    reboot

    reboot Inactive

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    Christer, we're both right.
    A cloned ghosted HD, is a byte by byte copy.
    An image is a file by file copy.
    Who cares?
    End result is exactly the same. I have never run into a problem with a tested image.
    The single largest problem people have with restoring an image, is not getting a boot sector write, thus the newly restored hard drive must be "repaired" in order to boot...that is writing the boot sector to the hard drive, either through a "sys c: ", or repair install.
    If your ghost image is bootable, then the finished hard drive will be bootable, but most people don't make the image bootable, because they don't read instructions. ;) http://ghost.radified.com has full instructions.

    JAK, you have email. (reposted here for info)
    Two ways you can do it.
    1.) Make the image, swap drives, restore the image.
    2.) Mount both drives, ghost, remove old drive, put new in it's place.
    #2 is easier, and faster, but then you wont' have a backup on disk of your drive.

    The difference in size is irrelevant. The new drive will simply contain more unused space, formatted, and ready to use.
    No extra partitions or anything.
     
  8. 2003/11/17
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff

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    Hi Reboot!

    I have read the Radified Guide to Norton Ghost but it seems like I´ll have to re-read it.
    I also keep an eye on the forum over there.

    Christer
     
  9. 2003/11/17
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff

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    I had a quick look in the guide and can´t find that making the Image bootable (no need for the Ghost Boot Disks on floppies) should make a difference towards the resulting new drive, "restored" using the Image, being bootable or not.

    On an earlier occasion, I did this test:

    I reformated my system partition to give it a new random serial number.

    Next, I restored using my Image.
    When I checked I found that the new serial number had been reset to the previous (the one on the Image) and my software, which has a license tied to the HDD serial number, worked just fine.

    Am I correct that all information was included in that Image, which was not bootable?

    Or am I being thick again?

    Christer ...... :confused: ......
     
  10. 2003/11/17
    reboot

    reboot Inactive

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    You're correct.
    The image is complete, wether it's bootable or not, however!...here's the problem...
    Depending on which version of Ghost you have, and if you're using the same version to RESTORE the image as you did to MAKE the image, if it's going to work or not. This is where a repair of the boot sector may be needed...

    Ghost writes a disk as if it were new, unpartitioned, unformatted, inactive, nonfdisked etc...it just doesn't care. It extracts the image, and writes it to the hard drive, starting at track 0, head 0, sector 0. Any extraneous size left over is simply formatted.

    It makes no difference if you're cloning a disk, or restoring an image (backup). The end result is EXACTLY the same as the original hard drive, including the serial number etc. It is a true CLONE.

    Imaging is done file by file, because it's faster, and (at the base level byte by byte) is more accurate. If you want to try a test, start with a badly fragmented hard drive, create an image, then restore it. You'll find that the hard drive is no longer (as badly) fragmented. This is the "file by file" system at it's finest. You'll also notice that the swap file is NOT included in the image (THANKYOU NORTON GHOST!!!) as it used to be in older versions.
    Ghosting a drive to drive results in the same fragmentation of the end result, because it's done like the old DOS "discopy" command, byte by byte, including blank space, fragmented files, the swap file etc.

    Now that you know how ghost does the difference between byte and file, it still doesn't really matter, because the end result is exactly what you wanted.
    Ghost simply works, better (and faster) than any other software of this type.
     
  11. 2003/11/17
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff

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    Reboot,
    thanks for the clarification!

    You explained it as I thought it would be, the difference between file by file imaging and byte by byte cloning, that is.

    Symantec Support once mentioned that a fragmented drive will be restored in an unfragmented state and that was almost too good to be true but "not as badly fragmented" is good enough.

    I guess it was intruduced on Ghost 2003 (which I use) to exclude "one session Windows files" from the Image. Very good with the demands that XP puts on the size of the pagefile and the siszes of RAM that are dumped to the hiberfile.

    When creating an Image, the FAT or MFT is included. Those are the result of the formating procedure, right?

    I have noticed that it takes approximately the same time to restore the Image to the original source partition as it took to create it, which indidicates to me that the formating process is simply an issue of putting the imaged FAT or MFT back.

    However, when an Image of a 10 GB partition on an old HDD, is restored to a 20 GB partition on a new HDD, Ghost has to have a trick or two up its sleeve.

    Does Ghost extend the previous (imaged) FAT/MFT or what happens?

    I know, I know, I´m getting too technical again,
    Christer
     
  12. 2003/11/18
    reboot

    reboot Inactive

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    The difference between unformatted space (brand new or 0's written by a utility), and formatted space (FAT, FAT32, NTFS, or any other type), is what the FAT registers. During the clone/image process, ghost determines the size of the new drive, and simply adjusts the contents of the FAT to compensate, either up or down. Very smart software :D
    Currently (AFAIK), Ghost only supports microsoft file systems, however, at work we have a version of Ghost that also reads/writes/clones/images CP/M, OSX, whatever...not cheap!
     
  13. 2003/11/18
    Christer

    Christer Geek Member Staff

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    Reboot,
    it seems like my understanding of the difference between formated and unformated space was not too far off ...... :cool: ...... !

    According to my Norton Ghost 2003 User's Guide, it supports all FAT, all NTFS and EXT2/3.

    Christer
     
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