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Old 22nd October 2008   #1
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Vista boot problem: F8 / F11 does not work, windows boot manager error


Hello,
My notebook crashed. I cannot boot up. F8 does not work, holding F11 does not work. i get windows boot manager, and it says:
windows failed to start. a recent hardware or sotware change might be the cause. to fix the problem:
1) insert your windows installation disk and restart
2)click repair your computer

i dont have this disk. HP told me i have to order the recovery disk, and lose everything on both my internal hard drives, and re-install the operating system.

Does this sound correct to you?

I am running Vista Home Premium, on an HP pavillion dv9000, T7200, 2 100gb internal hard drives.
I called Best Buy Geek Squad, They had me bring it in for a free 15 minute diagnostic. They had a special cd, and tried repairing the registry, That didn't work. Thay suggested that I use a Vista cd and try repairing or reinstall the OS. He told me that while repairing with the cd, there is a 50/50 chance i will lose everything on both hard drives, and ultimately reformat. He suggested i buy a sata to usb cable from Fry's, so I did. With this cable, i can remove both hard drives, and back them up to the external hd, with the use of another computer. Fry's told be i could not backup my programs, as they are copywrited.
I am wondering if i can use a program from Acronis, called True Image. I have a feeling this will backup all my programs and settings, so i am going to do some research on this.
I am getting ready to order the recovery cd from HP. I have to pay for this, and think it is rididculous these don't come from the mfgrs' with all new computers, though I do take partial blame for not making one myself when I got the notebook.
I found this link on the net:

http://neosmart.net/blog/2008/window...disc-download/

What do you think of this, worth a try? Best Buy put a scare in me when i mentioned it, stating that it could contain some sort of computer bot, that would use a portion of my processor everytime i am on the net, and would be very difficult to know or detect, hiding itself from all spyware/virus software. I am thinking of maybe trying this, and trying the repair feature. If you suggest I do, do you also suggest that I first remove the hard drives and try backing up everything? If I use the repair feature from this link, or the HP recovery cd, do I in fact risk losing everything on my internal hard drives? Or, do I wait for the HP cd, back up to external, then repair?

I have some options here, can you give me any suggestions or advice?

Thank you,
Jim

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Old 22nd October 2008   #2
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I went ahead and downloaded the link I posted above. I burned the image, booted with it, and clicked repair. It worked like a dream. Fixed a windows booting problem. Everything seems to be fine now. Thanks.

I have created a 12gb partition on my second internal hard drive(d). I would like to install XP here, and have a dual boot system. Can I simply put windows XP cd in and install? will it ask me where or what partion to install it in? Can I do anything to damage Vista in the process, or possibly stop Vista from booting up? I am afraid after install, it wont boot to Vista, and xp having some driver issues or something, that prevents me from booting all together. I really want to get this done, but feel like i am playing with fire. Am I?


Last edited by CHGOJim; 22nd October 2008 at 21:13.
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Old 23rd October 2008   #3
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If you have purchased a HP, you will need to work by their rules.

If the system breaks down, I would expect that you would need to "recover" using their system. Look up the recovery method at their website.

Repartitioning, does HP support it? Dual booting, same.

You should install the oldest operating system before the newest, when making a dual boot. There is information at the MS knowedgebase, but you will need to correspond that with information at HP.

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Old 23rd October 2008   #4
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Yes I have an HP pavillion, but it is out of warranty. Is this what you mean by "their rules", as in not to void warranty? I made the system recovery disk yesterday. I already made the partition, 20 GB, on the second(D) 100GB internal hard drive, using Acronis Disk Director. I used Acronis True Image and made a complete backup image of both internal hard drives onto an external hard drive.
When you say i "should" install XP first, is this a must? I would have to reformatt, and the true image backup has to be reinstalled in it entirety. I was hoping to just install XP on the partition, and use a boot manager.
Thanks Matt

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Old 23rd October 2008   #5
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By "their rules", you may have to look at what may happen if their "normal" Windows installation needs to be reinstalled, will it wipe out any changes you have made to the system and replace it with their factory image? Will the recovery system fail to work because it is geared to use the original partitioning? Those are the things I would check. I don't use "backup software", I just keep my important data backed up on other drives or optical disks and reinstall the OS if required. You will need to look at how the changes work with the backup system. If it comes to "putting the system back" after a catastrophe, I would rather have a fresh OS and install new versions of applications and software rather than trying to get them "up to date". We have different methods of backup.

You can try a boot manager if you like. Be careful about it's operation (compatibility) with Vista. I prefer the Windows boot manager system because they are "built in", I have found some third party boot managers can be complex if you want to change the system setup later on.

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Old 23rd October 2008   #6
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I will rant on a little more

Say you make the changes and something goes wrong. Will True Image reset all the partitioning (Boot Sector) information? Might you be stuck between a rock and a hard place by needing to zero format the drive, then finding you cannot get it back to where the HP installation can work? I suppose you could send it to HP to be re-imaged.

Just pointing out what I would be cautious about.

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Old 24th October 2008   #7
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booting problems vista home premium


Hey,seen your post. looks like we have simalar problems.
I just bought new vista cd.Thought I would try it.I have two eighty gigabyte hard drives.XP on one,vista on the other.It worked great for a couple of days.
Now when I boot up,I get blue screen for split second. Then it trys to boot again. How do I stop the blue screen so I can read the error message.
Buy the way this the second install I did. I welcome any advice you may have.


Blue screen blues
Saucier,Ms

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Old 25th October 2008   #8
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Originally Posted by CHGOJim View Post
Hello,
My notebook crashed. I cannot boot up. F8 does not work, holding F11 does not work. i get windows boot manager, and it says:
windows failed to start. a recent hardware or sotware change might be the cause. to fix the problem:
1) insert your windows installation disk and restart
2)click repair your computer

i dont have this disk. HP told me i have to order the recovery disk, and lose everything on both my internal hard drives, and re-install the operating system.

Does this sound correct to you?

I am running Vista Home Premium, on an HP pavillion dv9000, T7200, 2 100gb internal hard drives.
I called Best Buy Geek Squad, They had me bring it in for a free 15 minute diagnostic. They had a special cd, and tried repairing the registry, That didn't work. Thay suggested that I use a Vista cd and try repairing or reinstall the OS. He told me that while repairing with the cd, there is a 50/50 chance i will lose everything on both hard drives, and ultimately reformat. He suggested i buy a sata to usb cable from Fry's, so I did. With this cable, i can remove both hard drives, and back them up to the external hd, with the use of another computer. Fry's told be i could not backup my programs, as they are copywrited.
I am wondering if i can use a program from Acronis, called True Image. I have a feeling this will backup all my programs and settings, so i am going to do some research on this.
I am getting ready to order the recovery cd from HP. I have to pay for this, and think it is rididculous these don't come from the mfgrs' with all new computers, though I do take partial blame for not making one myself when I got the notebook.
I found this link on the net:

http://neosmart.net/blog/2008/window...disc-download/

What do you think of this, worth a try? Best Buy put a scare in me when i mentioned it, stating that it could contain some sort of computer bot, that would use a portion of my processor everytime i am on the net, and would be very difficult to know or detect, hiding itself from all spyware/virus software. I am thinking of maybe trying this, and trying the repair feature. If you suggest I do, do you also suggest that I first remove the hard drives and try backing up everything? If I use the repair feature from this link, or the HP recovery cd, do I in fact risk losing everything on my internal hard drives? Or, do I wait for the HP cd, back up to external, then repair?

I have some options here, can you give me any suggestions or advice?

Thank you,
Jim
Hi Jim, I had the same problem with a brand new Laptop an HP DV9830. In my case I was able to return it to Circuit City for a brand new computer but the reason I am writing is I use Acronis True image and it backs up everything. In fact it's designed to back up only the operating system and programs if that is what the user wants. I don't know how well you will do in backing up the computer that will not boot, I have absolutely no experience in that area. But I do know that Acronis works. I hope the Acronis True Image information helps. Good luck.
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Old 26th October 2008   #9
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Thank you all for the replies


I have spoken to Acronis tech support. Apparently, the True Image backup i have will put the system back to exactly where it was when i made the image of both hard drives and partitions. No matter how much confirmation of this I get, I would still like to avoid putting that to the test. When i do a Yahoo search(adding XP to Vista), It returns many informative results, that leave me more confused than ever. One in particular, stresses the need for drivers, and even states that I need to download the appropriate drivers, use a program to incorporate these drivers into the XP cd, and install them together with the XP operating system. While other thorough tutorials make no suggestion of this.
I also took your suggestion Matt, and spoke with HP. They will not be supportive of any third party software or operations out of the ordinary. They don't suggest dual booting, and state that it has not been tested on their systems. I feel they are not gonna be of any help, and deter me one way or the other. There does, however, seem to be many people out there that have been successfull installing XP after Vista, according to my Yahoo search results. It seems to me like i just need to gather enough courage, and faith in my "True Image" backup, and give this a try.
I think the main concern I have is the XP drivers issue. I don't know why one tutorial instructs me to incorporate them into the XP install cd, while others make no note of this. Hp directed me to a link of drivers for my notebook, but i don't see one for the sata hard drives. The sata driver seems to be the one they focus on the most. It would be nice to think that XP would find all the necessary drivers it needs after installation.
The biggest concern I have is that when I install XP, apparently, it changes the booting process. I will not be able to boot back to Vista untill some changes are made, through XP. Now, the issue is, what if XP doesn't work? Can i boot to the Vista boot disk that I downloaded and tested through the link I previously posted, click repair, and it will repair the booting process again, to boot back into Vista? If the answer to this question is yes, I truely don't have much to lose by giving this a try.

Thanks, and I hope this post doesn't confuse you as much as it does me, lol.


Last edited by CHGOJim; 26th October 2008 at 17:33.
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Old 26th October 2008   #10
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Originally Posted by CHGOJim View Post
I have spoken to Acronis tech support. Apparently, the True Image backup i have will put the system back to exactly where it was when i made the image of both hard drives and partitions. No matter how much confirmation of this I get, I would still like to avoid putting that to the test. When i do a Yahoo search(adding XP to Vista), It returns many informative results, that leave me more confused than ever. One in particular, stresses the need for drivers, and even states that I need to download the appropriate drivers, use a program to incorporate these drivers into the XP cd, and install them together with the XP operating system. While other thorough tutorials make no suggestion of this.
I also took your suggestion Matt, and spoke with HP. They will not be supportive of any third party software or operations out of the ordinary. They don't suggest dual booting, and state that it has not been tested on their systems. I feel they are not gonna be of any help, and deter me one way or the other. There does, however, seem to be many people out there that have been successfull installing XP after Vista, according to my Yahoo search results. It seems to me like i just need to gather enough courage, and faith in my "True Image" backup, and give this a try.
I think the main concern I have is the XP drivers issue. I don't know why one tutorial instructs me to incorporate them into the XP install cd, while others make no note of this. Hp directed me to a link of drivers for my notebook, but i don't see one for the sata hard drives. The sata driver seems to be the one they focus on the most. It would be nice to think that XP would find all the necessary drivers it needs after installation.
The biggest concern I have is that when I install XP, apparently, it changes the booting process. I will not be able to boot back to Vista untill some changes are made, through XP. Now, the issue is, what if XP doesn't work? Can i boot to the Vista boot disk that I downloaded and tested through the link I previously posted, click repair, and it will repair the booting process again, to boot back into Vista? If the answer to this question is yes, I truely don't have much to lose by giving this a try.

Thanks, and I hope this post doesn't confuse you as much as it does me, lol.
This is over my head now. The only thing I'm trying to figure out is how can you do an Acronis True Image backup if the coputer is frozen?

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Old 27th October 2008   #11
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Originally Posted by CHGOJim View Post
One in particular, stresses the need for drivers, and even states that I need to download the appropriate drivers, use a program to incorporate these drivers into the XP cd, and install them together with the XP operating system. While other thorough tutorials make no suggestion of this.
If your Win XP disk includes Service Pack 2, you probably won't need to install drivers. You can just try booting to the Win XP CD and see if it can find the hard drive.

As I was saying, HP are relatively inflexible. If something goes wrong, I suppose they will happily sell you Restore disks or re-image your drive, for a cost. I don't know retail laptops very well, but I think you would feel less restricted with one of the other brands. I just want you to be prepared if the worst happens. You are making some serious changes and they can be known to go very wrong at times. On the other hand, you will learn a lot and I suppose any repair costs could be put down as "educational expenses"

Originally Posted by CHGOJim View Post
Can i boot to the Vista boot disk that I downloaded and tested through the link I previously posted, click repair, and it will repair the booting process again, to boot back into Vista? If the answer to this question is yes, I truely don't have much to lose by giving this a try.
The link doesn't work, the URL appears to be copied incorrectly. As I said at the beginning, look up the recovery method at the HP website. On the HP systems I know, you can make a set of recovery disks yourself. Is the download "above board"? WHETHER the recovery disks will work after you have changed the partitions, I don't know. It might be a case of try it and see. You may want to search or ask at the HP forums.

Sorry I can't help with specifics, I don't know if it will all go smoothly or you may have trouble with the "inflexibilities" I have mentioned. It will be your decision. I suppose you will never know if you never try.

A point I hinted about...
When you may be finished with one or other OSes and you want to reclaim the space for storage, what sort of problems will you encounter? Can you uninstall the dual-boot system cleanly?

You have investigated well.

I can only point out what might go wrong.

Originally Posted by Markala
The only thing I'm trying to figure out is how can you do an Acronis True Image backup if the coputer is frozen?
Markala, if the system is "broken" you want to do a restore, not a backup. CHGOJim has done a full system backup, so if things go badly, a restoration of the system should(?) take it back to when the backup was made. If you do a partial backup, obviously, you won't be able to restore anything that was not backed up.

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